#21

ooo polyphonic playback is nice.
I guess being able to do live looping is a big plus as well

1 Like
#22

i don’t think so (at least i haven’t heard it can)… but with 16 tracks you can just “overdub” onto another track… of course, you’d be limited to 16 layers…one per track… but it’s probably enough…

actual overdubbing, though, would be amazing. but it seems they’re marketing it more of a “sampler” than a “looper”…

#23

and a Big Bright Touchscreen

#24

I was considering a BitBox for a while, but was ultimately turned off by the lack of support for overdubbing.

And, per the comment on the 1010 forum, I don’t expect that it will be a feature prioritized on the Blackbox either. Which is totally their right, but still something I find slightly disappointing :sweat_smile:

#25

There’s one essential thing @shellfritsch forgot: stereo sampling. Yum!

1 Like
#26

I think the main idea is to offer a workflow like Ableton Live in hardware, at least many aspects seems to point at that. Adding a more looper-oriented workflow would likely result in a conceptually less “clean” solution. Just as with Live, I can also see the loop-playing aspect as being pretty central here.

Yes, fair point! I’m sure one could adapt to that. There’s enough in there to give one plenty to work with.
It’s definitely an intriguing proposition.

2 Likes
#27

saw this in person on saturday, looks and feels great. i have the bitbox module which i really like.

1 Like
#28

Hi all, I’m Dan. I have some involvement with 1010music, producing demos, exhibiting at trade shows, beta-testing, etc. I just wanted to jump in and answer some of your questions. I might not know the answers to everything, but Aaron is active on the 1010music forum if I don’t know.

Yes, each cell can run independently if you turn off the quantise settings. You can modulate the Step count, Step Length and Duty Cycle of each of the 16 sequencers.

Yes, it will happily stream very long samples from the micro SD card. The sequencers have up to 128 steps of up to 8 bars long, for very long, slowly evolving sequences.

The initial version does support a few MIDI CC’s, like Volume, Pan, and Mod Wheel. More are in the works. I have a faderbank16N and would love to see support added for that.

Yes, you can trigger them via MIDI or the touch screen. There’s a few different playback options. Use the quantise settings to keep them all in sync, or turn if off to let them run in a freeform manner.

Not currently. It’s set up more as recorder/looper. You can patch back into the input (and turn off record monitoring so you don’t get a feedback loop) to resample, though.

This box is great for getting ideas down quickly. It has a more powerful processor than the series 1&2 modules. The latency is fast, so it’s perfect for live applications. You can use it like 16 instruments each on their own MIDI channel, or 16 loop recorders, where you can dial in a particular bar length and it will starts looping automatically, and you can toggle them on and off.

I’ve been using it as a compact sound source for my electronic drum kit and it works great. You can use the PADS screen like a mini MPC, and the KEYS screen is very handy when you don’t have a controller around. The Slicer function is also extremely powerful, and you can zoom in to sample level to adjust the slices, or edit the notes in the piano rolls. It definitely has a lot of potential, in a lot of different markets.

10 Likes
#29

Thank you for posting here to give a better understanding of this exciting new instrument’s capabilities.

But overdubs are an essential part of what makes a looper a looper. So please pardon my harsh words, but to call something a looper without offering overdubbing is bordering on false labeling in my book.

Which reminds me of Elektron’s Octatrack release early 2011: The marketing material called out all sorts of applications for the new box, including looping. But it took Elektron until May 2012 to release an OT update with overdubbing capabilities (the so-called “pickup machines”).

Yes, that’s a workaround for overdubbing, but in order to make it work, you have to
(a) use one of the Blackbox’s stereo output to output just the track you want to overdub,
(b) route this stereo output thru a mixer where you mix it only with the signal you want to loop & overdub, while
© sending this stereo output signal to the mixer’s main output at the same time for hearing it, and
(d) once you are done with overdubbing this loop, you have to route this track to a different stereo output in order to avoid that its signal will spill into the overdub of a different track you want to overdub on. And finally
(e) you have to carry a mixer with 2 separately adressable output groups with you, which somewhat lessens the Backbox’s benefit of being an easy to carry device.

Really, it would be great if you can help convince Aaron that overdubbing is something that it is integral to a looper. Having to fiddle around with mixer and routing settings to accomplish overdubbing is clumsy.

This is the same argument that has been brought up by 1010music in the past when discussing the missing overdub capabilities on the original Bitbox, but it overlooks how overdubbing works on a real looper: you can just continue to play your instrument after the loop ends, as the loop will automatically jump back to the beginning and while continuing to record. In other words: There is no user interaction required to change from one overdub layer to the next.

If you use a Bitbox to simulate overdubbing by seeing each of its 16 tracks as one overdub, you have to manually select the next track you want to record on, make sure it has the right recording length and start the recording on this track, all while you are trying to continue to play. It is clumsy and interrupts the musical flow.

My apologies for my rant, but this topic is quite dear to my heart.

2 Likes
#30

You make some good points. It would certainly make it much more powerful. I’ll discuss it with him further.

3 Likes
#31

Not a new idea but nice to see another take on it! Looks very well made, and could be very compelling.

I’m of the belief that the toolbox though is still a sequencer that has the most potential and I hope it keeps getting updates, which is to say I hope this doesn’t take too much attention away from it. :wink:

1 Like
#32

Does anyone know what the raw hardware inside is? Is it just a Linux box? Are the audio, screen, and controls all “standard” and accessible? Is 1010 likely to make this mostly open?

I love the hardware(*) - but the “DAW in a box” software doesn’t suit me at all. If I could just run stock Linux on it - and connect the I/O to my own software (written with SuperCollider and/or Pd, say) - then I’d buy one!

(*) Okay, if it had 2 stereo inputs, then I’d be falling all over it.

#33

The os is all embedded code. Not sure how "open " it is, but MOK ported their WaveRazor oscillator to the platform. https://mok.com/wr_dual.php

#34

i agree 100%… it’s a missing feature for sure, and the workaround i suggested is far from fluid or practical when you’re looping.

i’d say in defense of Bitbox, they’ve probably made this as a “sampler” not a “looper”… though i certainly wish they made it to be a looper…

2 Likes
#35

I think I’m sold.

4 Likes
#36

What loopers do you think are really well-designed & useable? Do you know a good multi-track one? I feel I’ve only found clumsy ones.

#37

If that’s really the path you want to travel, consider the Bela platform – it’s Debian-based, and the hardware is quite good.

#38

Well, If I were going to DIY my whole box (and I might) - I’d probably build on the PiSound I already use. What I like here is the nice enclosure, the screen and controls - in a well thought out package.

#39

I’m using an Elektron Octatrack. As a looper, it is not really well-designed & usable. But over the years, I found my way of dealing with its shortcomings and playing to its strengths. And I have not found any other looper that does for me what the Octatrack does.

I tried the Boss RC-505, but it didn’t work for me. It sure does for others, see below. But perhaps that’s due to me not being really well-designed & usable as a musician…

3 Likes
#40

I got my blackbox in and shot an unboxing and run-trough of some features: https://youtu.be/7e-UZrn76IY
I really like it a lot! It seems super intuitive to me so far, but I’m not coming at it with experience using other samplers or even Ableton – just a guy who likes messing around w modular and POs and things like that.

2 Likes