#23

This is what the Orthogonal Devices ER-301 is all about! Seems to be a real trend of putting these in lunchbox cases, for mobile/couch usage.

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#24

Cheap gear can be great and not-cheap gear can be not-great. Though in general, I agree. Quality gear certainly takes the guess work out of it. If I canā€™t EQ a track decently enough with my UA plugins, I certainly shouldnā€™t look to other plugins to overcome my shortfalls. Iā€™d rather have a lot to learn with one solid piece of equipment than a lot of mediocre stuff to sift through. Iā€™ll never master anything that way.

#25

And I so want oneā€¦ just been a little light on funds lately. Not to mention I have mixed feelings about the computer-in-a-module devices that have been proliferating lately. I donā€™t own a Teletype. Iā€™m just so turned off of menu diving and manual flippingā€¦ one reason I was having a tough time with my SMR :slight_smile: Maybe I just need to bite the bullet and surrender that the ER-301 does everything I want.

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#26

Itā€™s some of the nicest menu diving Iā€™ve ever experienced.

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#27

I agree for the most part, but there can be a place for some cheaper gear for specific sounds and uses.

I never wanted a PO until the PO-32, which I got and love. But itā€™s the only one that lets you make your own sounds via a really powerful synthesis engine. Hooked up to a good sound system it has serious depth.

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#28

Am I right in thinking that you can only make sounds in utonic? Then transfer them to po32? If you can manipulate sounds onboard I might have to jump on this one!

#29

There are a few parameters you can manipulate (and sequence) on the device, as well as effects. Otherwise you are correct, you create a kit in utonic and ā€œuploadā€ it to the device.

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#30

thinking of getting an analog rytm mk2. looking for opinions.

-c

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#31

Love mine. It takes some time to get to know, the LFO goes to audio rates and is really a necessary component in getting the most out of the internal synthesis, and gain staging internally is an essential and careful balance. But once you get the hang of a few quirks itā€™s a beautiful sounding, deep drum synthesizer with 8 unique voices and of course sampling as well. The individual outs lend themselves well to gated reverbs and other external tricks and itā€™s got a brilliantly playable workflow with song mode, fill queuing, and the scenes/performance macros.

But be prepared to spend quality time with it to get to the good stuff. Itā€™s not hard to make it sound Ā« ok Ā» but it takes some work to make it sound Ā« amazing Ā». But it truly can.

Also: donā€™t try to make it sound like another drum synth. Just use samples if you need to clone another sound. Itā€™s got a totally different set of voices and sounds unique. Roll with that and youā€™ll be very happy. Try to force it into something else and youā€™ll be frustrated. Think of it this way: you wouldnā€™t try to make an 808 sound like something it isnā€™t, and the rytm is equally iconic.

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#33

Pads on the Mk2 are really nice, in my opinion. There were a few units shipped with pads that were slightly too tightly installed, causing some issues with hitting one pad triggering another unintentionally, but most units are fine and theyā€™re authorizing in-store swaps if you end up with one of the units with that problem and report it promptly after purchase, so keep an eye out for it but donā€™t panic if you end up with it.

The thing I really like is that the performance macros are pressure sensitive, so you can push lightly to scale the macro effect just a little bit, or push fully to get the full oomph. This is really cool with things like ratchet/retrig, delay or reverb sends, or pitch / timbral changes (or all of those at once!) as they can be ā€œplayedā€ with the aftertouch.

I donā€™t fingerdrum so I canā€™t comment on their usability for finger drumming, but for just pounding out a beat in freehand record mode theyā€™re great too since being velocity sensitive you get a much more natural sounding groove right off the bat just from your natural variation in playing.

In fact the pads are the main reason I didnā€™t go with a used MkI and I remain happy that I didnā€™t (although the MkI is much more conveniently sized for portability).

I donā€™t really sample, so I canā€™t comment on the sample input / workflow, but the sample playback goes through the analogue filters, digital effects, and analogue drive and compression, so even ordinary samples can come out sounding somehow a bit more beautiful and larger than life - this is a great feature.

Gripes (all minor) but lots o' details, click me to read a wall of text
  • Thereā€™s no gain control on the ā€œinputā€ for external audio and the gain is VERY LOW. Getting external audio to mix right with the internal drum levels is a huge balancing act and requires gainstaging the internal audio sources quite low.
  • The unit is rather large - not ā€œtooā€ big, and certainly it feels a bit luxurious to have on your desk, itā€™s perfect for a studio, and if you have a large backpack or the dedicated Elektron bag to carry it in, itā€™s very easily portable, but itā€™s just awkwardly large for an ordinary messenger bag or student backpack. If you plan to tote it around a lot, be aware. I highly advise the decksaver lid for it too in this case as itā€™s a bit heavy and could probably easily damage itā€™s knobs as theyā€™re rather vulnerable when itā€™s being squeezed by a bag and jostled around.
  • You really do need to control gainstaging at nearly every level within the audio internally - itā€™s easy to overdrive it and it actually sounds quite good up to a point, but as you start to layer the voices up - especially using the beautiful bass oscillator voices itā€™s got, youā€™ll easily push it past that point by accident and get nasty breakup. Since compression comes dead last in the chain (maybe except for final distortion, I canā€™t remember offhand right now, but both are compression of sorts) you canā€™t rely on it to save you - the signal gets summed both before the effects, internal to the effects using the sends, and after the effects, in addition to the sample and synth summing within each voice. I know this sounds complex, but once you get the hang of it it sort of becomes second nature and itā€™s not a lot of work to do anyway, more something you tweak as it becomes an issue.
  • Donā€™t use the ā€œBDā€ pad for bass drum. The engines on the LT (ā€œlow tomā€) actually make a far more convincing and satisfying bass drum if realism or traditional drum synth sounds are your thing. The BD pad is best used for the bass synth voice if youā€™re using it, or if you want a dedicated pad for sample playback only, use that. Itā€™s got the ā€œworstā€ traditional oscillator engines of all of the pads, but if experimental strange plastic awkwardness is your thing, then lean on it hard!
  • The choke groups are backwards from the traditional use - normally the closed hat chokes the open hat because closing a hi hat cuts the open sound and you can always close an open hat but opening a closed hat doesnā€™t really ā€œdoā€ muchā€¦ but on the AR itā€™s the other way round, at least as labelled. The labels are arbitrary, though, so just invert them if you want. Same for the rimshot/clap - the longer, louder sound chokes the shorter, sharper one, this makes no sense to me at least. The other chokes are rather arbitrary, so donā€™t go by the traditional labels if they donā€™t make sense to you.
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#35

Although I donā€™t use them myself, my label partner uses the mbrane quite extensively as a kind of ā€˜percussion instrumentā€™ as opposed a ā€˜drumā€™, kind of like a marimba or set of tuned wood blocks compared to a standard kick drum. I think it sounds totally killer, infinitely versatile and distinctly analog. Itā€™s like a whole row of analog modules in a tiny box, with a very similar level of routable options. Pushing some parameters to their limits via the midi ccā€™s can also yield some seriously weird sequences for a percussion synth - Itā€™s something I donā€™t see much love for online and always wonder why! Would love to hear how you use yours :slight_smile:

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#37

Well, I was thinking we needed a Drum Machine/Drum Synth thread to discuss, compare contrast, but I suspect it would have been merged into this one, had I started a new oneā€¦ :wink:

Iā€™m preparing for a new project and in the sound prep stage, right now. For my last project most drums were Vermona DRM 1 III, Double Knot, or (last resort) Digitakt samples.

In the interim Iā€™ve acquired a Nord Drum 2 and old AceTone Rhythm Ace which has been modified with a Tubbutec Unipulse, so it can be played by midi and synced to Midi Clock.

The last few days Iā€™ve been editing and listening and comparing. I love the DRM1 III Kick, snare and clap, but OCD me has started to focus on the weaknesses.
Number one being the inability of the hihat channels to have independent decay/release times for open and closed - basically you cant have a really tight closed hat which opens to a long hat. The workaround is to use both channels but itā€™s pesky and tedious, and you still donā€™t get the ā€˜chokeā€™ effect of closing the open hat with the closed oneā€¦
Number two being the envelopes, Iā€™m afraid. I was trying (OK probably stupidly) to reproduce the acetone toms, and it took me quite a frustrated while to realise that the acetone decay/release is very short, but exponential, and thatā€™s whatā€™s so musical, to my earsā€¦ I doubt very much that the Vermona is mod-able to switch from linear decay to expo, but I will write to themā€¦

I did a bit of experimenting with Double Knot - modulating the envelopes with themselves and I got the sound I was looking for, sort ofā€¦

The Nord Drum 2 lets you choose between linear or exponential, and it sounds fantastic, to my ears, but it isnā€™t exactly hands on for a quick knob twiddle edit. I am working on becoming more fluent with itā€¦

So I wonder what else is out there?

I canā€™t go the Eurorack route. The options are basically infinite. I donā€™t have what it takes to deal with that.

MFB makes some great sounding machines, but their UI is without exception, so appalling, that Iā€™ve had to sell on everything of theirs Iā€™ve tried and vowed never to try again. I found myself wasting an hour yesterday looking at Tanzbar 2, before I shook myself. Ditto Elektron, Iā€™m afraid, although I wouldnā€™t say appalling for them - just Not For Me.

So that was a long way of saying that Iā€™m probably ready to sell the DRM1 III, if I can be sure I can get Nord sounds that Iā€™m happy with for the kick, snare, and clap, as It just bugs me to look at 4 channels that, right now, I canā€™t really use.

What alternative drum synths / drum machines should I investigate? I think maybe Iā€™ve tried most everything. I see a Mode Machines box, which has some demos sounding goodā€¦ but other than that, Iā€™m thinking I may need to pucker up and sample the DRM 1 with Digitakt and play with the envelopesā€¦

Any help greatly appreciated.

And yes, I am waiting for the Soma Pulsar 23, but I think that it will probably sit on the other side of the studio.

3 Likes
#38

Iā€™m very happy with the fusion of synthesis and sample in my Analog Rytmā€¦ I donā€™t use the internal sequencer so much except for sketching (where itā€™s brilliant) but I really love the sounds and the flexibility of the sound editing in my MkII - you can take the individual outs and further process them if you need/want to, also. But itā€™s deep and to get really good results from the internal synthesis you need to pay good attention to the gainstaging, make creative use of the LFO and overdrive, and often use the ā€œwrongā€ pad for the sound youā€™re looking for (e.g. kicks on the bass tom instead, or vice versa, depending on the tonality you want) since there are several different analogue sound engines internally and not all pads can utilize all engines.

2 Likes
#39

Are you open to software? Iā€™m really excited by some of the iPad based drum synths. These, and the Nord, benefit a lot from external midi controllers to make them hands-on.

I use these iPad apps all the time, and theyā€™re just as good as anything else Iā€™ve used:

  • Waldorf Attack
  • Ruismaker FM
  • Ruismaker (for classic x0x style drums)
  • Elastic Drums (has a good synth engine and interesting sequencer)

With a good midi controller (Faderfox UC4 is my choice) these can be really hands-on, and sound great (especially through a usb audio interface).

3 Likes
#40

Thanks! Not completely unopposed, but I have decided to restrict my iPad to what I bought it for - reading - books and manuals and ongoing wikis. I need to be able to do this while Iā€™m playing musicā€¦ I use a couple of virtual instruments in Logic, but I do prefer creating sounds outside the box.

#41

Have you played a Ciat-Lonbarde Plumbutter? If youā€™re into the Double Knot the Plumbutter might work well for you. It can produce very many ecstatic tones and other emotionally salient tones.

EDIT: You might also look into the JoMoX Alphabase thing. If I were going to buy a new drum machine, I would look into the Alphabase hardcore.

#42

I tried Plumbutter. I didnā€™t get on that well with it. Iā€™ve heard others make lovely stuff with it, but not meā€¦ I MUCH prefer Double Knot and Iā€™m thinking of adding a Mosstone to make a 3rd voice. I do like the JoMox stuff, but the sampled hihat really put me off so I sold the one I owned late 90sā€¦

1 Like
#44

BeatMaker 2 by INTUA


beatmaker 2 comes with all the sounds ipad/iphone

beatmaker 3 comes with some sounds, in app purchases, and plug ins /for ipad

#45

always a very fun challenge to try and make drum sounds with the hardware you have!

5 Likes
#46

Agreed. Except OCD me canā€™t look at what I perceive as flaws and wonder if they could be improved/fixed. Iā€™ve just written to Vermona and some tech folk who modded my Acetone in Philly to see if we can get expo decay and independent closed and open hats. Iā€™ll keep everyone posted.

While Iā€™m here If there are other DRM 1 users here - I just figured what now seems like a very obvious secondary use for it. Forgive me if everyone already figured this out, I only just did so. Because each channel has an individual out which can also work as an insert point, these outputs can also be used as inputs - turning the DRM1 into an 8 channel mixer. Just connect an insert cable and only the return, et voila! Not super elegant, and volume doersnā€™t work (pan does), but I had a few spare insert cables and now I donā€™t need a dedicated drum mixer on the drum tableā€¦

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