To second this, I’ve been using my Loquelic Iteritas for just this purpose (evolving drone) and it really shines with some (a lot of) modulation.

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Ah, tell me more @wardores and @ElectricaNada, please!

I think what they mean is that filters and wavefolders cut and boost certain harmonics.

If you sweep a filter with high resonance extremely slowly, you will hear individual harmonics come into focus and then fading out as the next gets emphasized. This effect can sound a lot like overtone singing.
As an extreme version you could mix several bandpass filters to emphasize multiple parts of the wave.

Wavefolders can take a simple waveform, like a sine, and multiply its frequency (Serge even called one of their wavefolders the Wave Multiplier) into various overtones.
They do this in a fairly dirty way so it’s not at all exact but the distortion is part of what makes them sound so good.

Another thing you could use is a comb filter to emphasize a structure of overtones all at once. If you sweep it too quickly you will just get flanging but a slow sweep will reveal the overlap between the overtones of your original sound and the comb.
Odessa has one of these built-in.

(Also fwiw I don’t think Odessa would be useful as a harmonic oscillator as it doesn’t let you fade individual harmonics or groups of them in and out. It focuses more on other additive techniques that are less available in hardware.)

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Take a complex monophonic sound source. Mult it into several filters and/or wave folders in parallel. Give each of them their own independent modulation. Give each channel independent fx treatments too if you have the capability. Mix those multiple outputs panned across the stereo field. You will get a huge evolving drone with shifting harmonics from a monophonic origin. If you can animate the panning it gets even bigger.

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This sounds great. I will try.

In terms of actual harmonic oscillators, Ensemble Oscillator isn’t quite that. You can modulate the balance or spread, but while that works beautifully for a sort of rolling, crossfaded arpeggio, it’s not as great as a harmonic sweep sort of thing.

I’m guessing that the Verbos Harmonic Oscillator is the top choice. There’s a pretty good harmonic oscillator custom unit for the ER-301 (I used a modified version that removed the sweep control and put each parttial under manual 16n Faderbank control), and it’s pretty easy to build something similar in Bitwig Grid. Possibly Zoia/Euroburo too, or Norns? I’m not sure.

I actually use the Akemie’s Castle this way somewhat – put it on the algorithm with three carriers and use slow LFOs or envelopes to bring them into and out of the mix.

I agree with the suggestion of bandpass filters/resonant filters though. I’m still working out what to do here myself. A couple of people have been advocating hard for the Serge Resonant EQ, and I’m sure it sounds lovely but I would rather have CVable frequency – so something like the ADDAC603 or Shelves is probably next on my list. Shelves has the advantage of being slightly smaller, much cheaper and lower power consumption, but it seems to me the 603 has more flexibility in many ways.

Also, I find Mimeophon’s Color control is quite good at emphasizing different spectral areas in its feedback.

The SynthTech E520 has (among a lot of other effects) some spectral filtering capability – one of which filters by amplitude threshold rather than frequency range. (E.g. if you filter out the strongest harmonics, there is a tendency to enhance weaker harmonics and noise in the signal, and vice versa) Sweeping those ranges with a relatively constant signal can definitely emphasize different areas in interesting ways.

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For what it’s worth, Just Friends can be a nice way to play with the (first five harmonics in the) harmonic series (which are also the most useful ones), the undertone series, and everything in between, plus enjoy waveshaping, plus enjoy everything else that Just Friends offers. To do Verbos HO-style manipulation, you’d need an interpolating scanner and/or VCAs, and lots of modulation sources. (You’d also need lots of modulation sources for the Verbos HO.)

The Verbos HO is a great module, but it’s a large, expensive one-trick pony. The trick is very good and characterful, but you have to really want it. I had one for a while. Nice build quality—although mine did require factory repair—and when it’s working correctly, it does deliver. I didn’t keep it very long, because I found my priorities lay elsewhere.

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Waiting for a just friends to come back into production!

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The Loquelic has a lot of ways to accomplish this built-in, then adding filters as @ElectricaNada suggested opens up even more possibilities. It has two oscillators, and you can set one as “master”. I’ll usually tune that to my desired note, then modulate the pitch of oscillator B, as well as the folding (it has a wavefolder as well). Modulating the pitch of B gives different harmonics while keeping the same fundamental pitch. If you really want to go crazy you can unsync (is that a word?) the two oscillators and modulate the pitch independently, resulting in really interesting textures.

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Question for fellow Streams owners- is there a way to extend the attack/decay (without patching in the level jack) beyond the amounts afforded by the shape knob that I’m missing?

Hi! I just got the semi-modular Moog system (DFAM, SubHarmonicon, Mother32), and I am planning right away to expand it.
I know synthesizers, but I am new to modular. I am planning to use the system for both live and studio, and I will use an external mixer to start.
Current set-up:
SYNTHS & DRUMS: mentioned Moog system (in transit, not delivered yet), Minitaur, Minilogue, MB33(with “personal” sequencer), Model: Samples.
FX PEDALS: H9 Max, MF Ring, Arena Verb.
EURORACK CASE: 2 rows Rackbrute.
The eurorack would be mainly an “expander” for the current set-up, but in the future, I am planning to create both a mono synth out of it, as well as drum parts.
Here is what I’ve thought of starting with, but my knowledge is limited.
Erica Pico MScale: CV converter specifically for Moog semi-modular;
Intellijel Quad Invert: seems like a functional utility;
Intellijel Buff Mult: same as above;
Intellijel Quad VCA: Powerful VCA & Cascade Mixer;
MN Maths: No brainer. Master utility. Attenuator, Envelope fol/gen, LFO, etc.;
PM LFO2: the Moog boxes have almost no LFO’s (Mother32 only), so I’ve thought to add another LFO (along with Maths) to keep things moving;
Strymon AA1: for FX pedals (and external synths/guitars?);
Mannequins 3 Sisters: unbelievable filter, I cannot even imagine what happens if paired with Moog ones;
Erica LINK: simple unpowered converter to send straight into the external mixer.
I feel like I miss an attenuverter and a substantial envelope follower (don’t want to have Maths doing EVERYTHING). But I probably miss more than that.
I’d like to have an oscilloscope as well; which are the ones that can do multiple tasks?
For VCO’s, I will abuse the Moog ones for starters. I don’t feel like I NEED a sequencer to start.
Is there any fundamental module missing in the system? What are your recommendations? What would you do if you had my set-up and wanted to expand? All tips and ideas are welcome. I am so excited about getting into modular; I literally cannot wait to hear the voice of the community.
Thank you all!

Two things: I’d slow things way down, play with the moogs for a few months before buying anything else. Then start with what you miss the most with the mothers…

Also: the Pittsburgh LFO does not have cv over rate, a must in my book…

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My $0.25:
Erica Pico MScale: Ok
Intellijel Quad Invert: Not sure why you buy something like this before you really needed it
Intellijel Buff Mult: You probably don’t need this right now, maybe never; pick up a few Tiptop Stackables
Intellijel Quad VCA: Ok
MN Maths: Agreed: no brainer.
PM LFO2: So many better options out there—look at Pamela’s New Workout or Batumi or Erica’s Black Octasource, DivKid Ochd, or Just Friends
Strymon AA1: Ok
Mannequins 3 Sisters: Yeah, it’s good. Instant classic. Quirky, though—expect it.
Erica LINK: Dubious use of rack space: just get some 1/4"-to-1/8" patch cords. They’re cheap.

In addition to Maths, there’s a good chance you’ll want an additional attenuation + offset. Many good ones out there. ALM’s O/A/x2 is a compact good choice. I also really like Klavis Mixwitch, and it has some interesting tricks up its sleeves.

For a scope, you can use your computer or tablet (with the right doodads) or pick up standalone unit. I have had the O’Tool+ and I currently have the Mordax Data; they both are great, but they’re expensive and consume rack space. Might be worth it to you, or not. Besides signal visualization, the main service they offer is tuner.

@a773 isn’t wrong saying to take it slow. On the other hand, this is an array of highly rational core utilities. It’s not like you’re throwing in a bunch of bells & whistles.

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Do you have any recommendations for iPad scope apps that can handle cv?

Thanks!

I don’t, no, but I’ll refer you to this thread at MW. I think the problem with the iPad is not the app—there are several—but a DC-coupled physical interface for the iPad.

I’d also look a this thread, here: Oscilloscope recomendation

… and these, too:
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=189511
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=185915
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=229726

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Thank you @mdoudoroff
Constructive insights, precisely the kind of help I was seeking. These suggestions are already a perfect start.
Any recommendations on computer scopes (no iPad) would be highly appreciated. And any further recommendations, for that matter :slight_smile:
Thank you again.

@a773 I appreciate your suggestion. Although, as Martin mentioned, I don’t think I went too crazy; I just added a little expansion with some core modules. For example, there’s an overall lack of LFO on the Moog’s.
Speaking of which, thank you for the LFO hint, very important. Which modules would you personally recommend if you had the 3 Moog’s with a weak build-in LFO capabilities?

For future replies, probably I should state that I am determined to add a few core modules to the Moog’s right off the bat.

Already appreciate the help so far! I truly enjoy this forum.

For bidirectional 4x LFO Xaoc batumi is nice, Xaoc Zadar might work as 4x unipolar LFOs, or envelopes or any combination of that, if you don’t mind a bit of menu diving.
For batumi attenuation is needed, for Zadar it’s built in.

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Also mutable instruments Stages.

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I agree with mdoudoroff maybe take it a little slower, (although I am guilty of exactly the same thing, I have the moog semi modulars in a 3 tier rack and a couple of cases of eurorack !) remember the pitch and velocity outs on the DFAM are a very good source of modulation, with some passive mults and attenuators you can shape these for use elsewhere, you may also want a quantiser to use those outputs musically, there really is a ton of things you can do with just the 3 Moogs. I think one of the most valuable things to put to use are the SIX quantised oscillators you get from the SubH, they a raw and can be shaped in anyway you want within a eurorack system, this is worth a thought when planning your system. A module with 6 VCA’s might be worth looking out for (if they exist) and something like MI stages which has 6 outputs that can be triggered by the gate output of the M32. What about a stereo output module? all those ocillators need a bit of panning I think! But seriously there are all sorts of directions you could take your system in and you might save a little money by waiting to get to know the moogs better. For what its worth one of the first modules I bought was the Erica Synths Mscale and to be honest i have hardly ever used it!

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Learn the Moogs first. You already have a very powerful system. Learn it before buying more stuff, or you’ll make buys you regret. If money is not an issue then maybe that doesn’t matter though…

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