Yes, but we don’t really have all the information on the table to create a fair opinion. And that is very risky.

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There’s a line—somewhere—past which it’s none of our business. This is a murky and confusing case, so I’m not sure where that line is.

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Hey i hope my post didn’t come across the wrong way…I don’t know you well but have really appreciated your insight while trying to understand all kinds of modular synths we have mutual interest in (I think I first saw some vids you shared on MW when whimsical released cold mac)

My intention wasn’t to sew doubt about the motives of anybody involved or derail this thread…I merely wanted to add some context since you thought another user was spreading misinformation. My post in response clearly stated that some of us haven’t been following the situation as closely as others…i’ll repeat: I found out BEMI no longer operates buchla company 2-3 days ago in this thread

So if I accidentally was making decisions based on outdated info I assumed there might be others (like @Joseph) who aren’t deliberately misleading anyone but speaking about what they heard before. I’m sorry if my explanation got under your skin.


Two other issues…as stated earlier the planned purchases and $$$ you want to spend on new gear from Buchla USA are totally fine. I’m not discouraging you from supporting them at all. Upthread you can probably see I’m now enthusiastic about the 208c and might trade/sell off gear to acquire one! Even if we disagreed on this point it would be cool.

Regarding the accuracy of my information on the matter…I know nothing beyond what don’s son, ezra buchla, has shared publicly in the past. It’s not my place to say whats true or what’s fair/ethical conduct and i doubt they want to be dragged into this thread to confirm or deny the veracity of any claims. When I said “last I heard” it was based on the frustration they expressed before Don’s passing about the state of things at that time.

Likely things have changed but as noted by @Joseph above, my understanding of the dispute was enough to personally refrain from pursuing new buchla gear for a while. That’s it.

I’m not judging anyone else for their choice and hope the thread can continue as before. Sorry for the tangent.

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The Buchla because it is an instrument rather than a collection of parts. I would prefer something that I can learn and not have to figure everything out again when the modules change.

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I just want to say that I completely relate to this. I got a small 200e system, sold it pretty quick. I got a couple R*S Serge panels and sold that quick too, though that was because of financial reasons vs WANTING to.

After Serge & Buchla, I said why the hell not and gave Ciat Lonbarde a shot. All 3 pieces of CL I have, have been staples of my workflow for the better part of a year now. Plumbutter is one of my favourite instruments, hands down!

I have a BUSA Easel now which is also one of my favourite instruments. It’s the INTERFACE mixed with the flexibility. I can sit down with some loopers and effects without feeling I need anything else. It’s also a piece I plan to never let go and if you knew me, you’d know that’s saying something :joy:

I’m currently exploring the option of revisiting a small serge system just to keep the tone and a more modular workflow around. Between Buchla, Serge & Euro, I much preferred Serge for its tone and workflow as far as an analog modular synth experience goes.

This is my long winded way of saying, I had to try it all. And it was expensive and unfortunate but only now do I feel that I know what I truly want. What I want CAN evolve of course but the important thing is I know what matters to me and what matters to me is interface. As far as interface goes the Ciat Lonbarde instruments and Buchla Easel are perfect for my needs!

I’m unsure if this is a worthwhile contribution to the thread but I needed to get that out :grimacing:

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I feel really drawn to Serge at this moment in time…a desire which has been building steadily over the years and has now reached a new crescendo after watching the cybernetics inspired patching of La Synthèse Humaine on YouTube. This whole process of patch programming, analog computing, and cybernetics spefically which I was never exposed to till now suddenly clicked as highly appropriate to explore in this day of Uber slick digital glossiness which I must admit I quite enjoy, so much so that I sometimes used to question the appropriateness of a mostly pure analog approach which is where I am with a 208 clone and bugbrand modular, both of which work well in creating the music i desire to listen to that hasn’t been created yet type thing.

But yes the Serge, just the way it looks. The utilitarian and raw industrialness which ironically I used to find quite ugly and plain along with doepfer. I’m really curious to experience t he sound of it. I can never properly tell from online demos but people speak so highly of it.I like each of my instruments to sound distinct.

For me buying these things is purely desire based…The only rationale that keeps me a bit conservative is I rarely sell anything and I also dislike the clutter of being surrounded by gear…Have only ever sold one synth around 10 years ago. So whatever I buy is in for the long haul…with euro I never got the feeling I could keep something without wanting to change it up so have never indulged in it. Happy to use friends gear tho…

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Given that my artistic focus is on musique concrète/abstract composition, and that I primarily work with a small Buchla system, I’ll push aside my usual hesitations about getting into gear discussion - especially since the op was specifically asking about this approach - and throw in my 2 cents:

I do not believe that any particular synthesizer brand or set of modules are inherently more suitable to creating concrete music. If anything, the general approach of this type of music has far more to do about editing (whether on magnetic tape, or computer), and ideas that are discovered from rather limited tools. In other words, when we’re talking about comparing a eurorack system (the one originally mentioned far exceeds the toolset that Pierre Henry had during his lifetime!), Serge, and Buchla, and asking which one might be more suitable for making concrete-style music, the most appropriate, yet possibly discouraging answer is: “yes”

In the photography world, there is a saying that the best camera and lens is the one you have in your hand, and I think the same is true about synthesizers. The more one uses the same set of tools over and over…working through the reoccurring moments of “I can’t do anything else with this thing”…the more one discovers a new approach to using it. I tend to consider the first 3-5 years of using a particular tool as working to get past the obvious.

Now, I do agree that comfort, scale, or style of interface (in particular, the reduction of distraction) can play roles, but there is really very little chance of adequately conveying that experience to someone else through words - everyone is different. What is a comfortable/inspiring scale or layout for me, certainly might not be for someone else. One person comfortably writes with a ballpoint pen, another with an HB pencil. So we come back to the question about which is better for experimental / musique concrète / ambient composition - eurorack, Serge, or Buchla?

“yes…and the one that is already sitting in front of you” :wink:

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sage advice. i remember reading an interview with suzanne ciani where she was saying how much she hated the music easel. her workflow was strictly modular and she wasn’t having it when don sent her one. that process of settling into tools that work on a deep level for you is so important and comes across on everything you do with the instrument.

No MARF on an Easel makes some of her best stuff impossible.

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@lilskullymane …only, Charles Cohen would prove those limitations were more conceptual than structural :slight_smile:

I could pick up a viola, hesitantly emit a few squeaks and gurgles, and wonder how anyone could produce anything transcendent out of it, before quickly being proven wrong by someone who has worked with that tool for several years.

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I’m currently trying to decide whether to keep my 208c. I find while it sounds great it’s kind of limited. I can see how Ciani would say that. I also find the value in just focusing on one instrument. Some of things Charles Cohen did on the Easel are just mind blowing. But if you watch some of the videos out there of him explaining what he does, he loops a lot, with a vintage EHX 16 second Delay driving the Easel with its clock. So he’s found a way around the limitations as well. I’ve tried looping with mine, syncing a looper to midi, and it’s tough to get the balance right, it gets muddy really fast.
This is why I started exploring Serge panels to augment the Easel. I considering buying more euro again, but I love the Serge aesthetics, form factor and banana.
If I sell the 208c, I’d replace the main sections with similar modules, but I could save a little money because i don’t really need the sequencer, the envelopes and random because I’ve already got that in other modules. Has anyone tried combining Buchla and Serge panels? I was thinking of perhaps getting a 258, the low pass gate modules, and then finding a Serge Wave Multiplier.

Has anyone got a link to Cianni’s comment on the Easel?

Always interesting to hear this stuff!

Yes, you are absolutely right. With the tools I have, I could spend a lifetime doing things without needing anything else. The point is that thinking about live performances sometimes I have the need to have another parallel system ready to be played.

And with regard to cameras, I have worked for many years as a photographer, and the analogy seems interesting to me. For many years I had all kinds of cameras: Hasselblad, Leicas, Mamiyas, 35mm, medium format, large format. Finally, I sold them all and kept a medium format rangefinder camera (Mamiya 7 II) and a large format camera (Toyo View 45). The experience of using each one and the photos I got with each one were completely different. That is perhaps what I am looking for now in this second equipment.

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Some limitations to expression are structural, same as with a clavichord vs the much louder but with agogic dynamics harpsichord. No one would play Scriabin on a fortepiano. Sometimes you need Wagner tubas not just trombone/horns. Even strings divisi is a structural means to expression.

How do you achieve her “Basic Performance Patch” on an Easel?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzjM8_WGedcRLVN5Wl84SFd5c3c/view

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Have you heard Alessandro Cortini’s Forse albums? They were done with just an Easel and a Big Sky… I’ve spent a lot of time “decoding” the pieces to figure out how he did what he did with the limited toolset.

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Thanks very much for that - good read!

Ah, I was speaking about the specific case of the Easel and Suzanne’s dismissal of it (have not read the article myself) . She might not have been able to envision replicating/distilling her existing methods of working with the larger system, but she could very likely have followed a parallel branch of composition with it. The Easel is a very good example of a tool that has a presumed way of working and palette, yet many artists (70s onwards) have demonstrated how it can move well beyond that. In Suzanne’s case, the 208 + MARF combo could cover a great deal of the ground , especially with external spatial effects, which she already makes use of with her current instrument.

There is no perfect choice - everything introduces constraints or potential, depending on what a person is trying to achieve at the moment. I feel a large part of that is in trying to replicate preconceived notions, rather than what evolves out of the conversation with an instrument facing you.

PS @Cromatica45 I’m pleased to hear that you enjoyed my analogy to photography - I have a long history with that medium as well.

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Now that I have the 208c, I’ve been listening to the Forse albums again and attempting the same thing.

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Yeah, his stuff is great, especially this record. One of the reasons why Ive wanted an Easel. I think the limitations of the Easel bother me because I came from euro where I had much more granular tools like Maths and Stages, where you can pretty much do whatever you can think up. The irony is that I sold all that to buy an Easel partially because I wanted limitations but I just think the limitations of the Easel I’m finding annoying because it’s like really a step back. For example, you can’t directly trigger the envelope generator with a gate, you have to indirectly do it via the keyboard in, seq or pulser. It makes it more like a fixed architecture mono synth, which sorta pushes you in a certain direction of thinking and therefore the sounds you tend to make. I know I could buy the Toolbox or hack the card interface, but not sure if i’d rather just buy different stuff. I’m thinking I may rather have the ingredients that make the Easel so I can make Easel sounds when I want, but not when I don’t. I general my interest is heading a little more experimental too and I feel like the Easel is really good at melodic playing but not as good for really getting into more granular experimental stuff.

Fwiw, on the most recent Source of Uncertainty podcast, Jonny Woods talks about playing Buchla and not doing all the tropes that are associated with Buchla, ie… Bongos, etc… it really got my thinking about this stuff.

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