#62

Is this just last year’s Mac mini that can be configured to be really really fast, or is there a new revision? I can’t find anything about the latter if so.

#63

Seems kind of weird to me that for the base model they would rather keep the 12 dimm slots for a useless amount of ram. It would make more sense to have a slightly less beefed up mobo for the base model and use that money to maybe expand other things like the storage.

Though I guess that it makes sense if what they want people to spend more on upgrading instead of just sticking to the base model.

I agree with @mdoudoroff though, this new mac pro seems to be more of a company image thing for apple.

#64

I believe it’s just updated internals like a new processor and gpu

#65

I think the new Mac Pro is bonkers in a good way. No, it isn’t for everyone. I think Apple does a remarkable job offering computing to the masses in their lineup, ranging from the iPod touch, to the various iPhones, to the iPad Pro. Apple products hold their value, too.

The overall knee-jerk internet reaction to the Mac Pro and the new monitor really illustrates that you can’t make everyone happy.

Pro users have long wanted another tower to replace the cheese grater, specifically the 2009 (4,1) to 2012 (5,1). This satisfies their internal PCIe expansion needs very nicely.

Other thoughts:
Apple is betting big on RAM usage vs CPU. No dual CPU option, meaning 28 cores “should” be enough for most pro users. I imagine they limited to one CPU because of power consumption.
I was disappointed to see a lack of onboard NVMe support, hopefully there will be more options for expansion cards that support multiple NVMe SSDs - maybe even support for bifurcation. Currently, the best option with the older Mac Pros is a Highpoint 7701a which supports four 2280 NVMe SSDs. The older Mac Pros do not support bifurcation. NVMe boot support just recently started working with the last High Sierra update, and with Mojave.
I like that the new handles are curved. I like that you can add wheels. I like that it comes with two onboard 10Gb ethernet ports. I wonder if the 3.5mm/USB A/thunderbolt card will be available separately so you can use multiples on one system. I am excited to see what other MPX modules will be used. I’m happy they re-introduced a monitor. I wonder if these vent holes will eventually make it over to the iMac Pro line.
Configuring these towers won’t be cheap. 128GB DDR4 ECC modules are about $1500 on the open market, so 1.5TB will be around $18000, which probably means an Apple markup of $24000+.
I’m curious if the CPU will be user replaceable. The 24 and 28 core CPUs support up to 2TB RAM, although the system is limited.

My current desktop configs utilize a few 2009/2010 Mac Pro towers. I upgraded the CPUs to Xeon x5670 dual 6 core/12 hyperthread for $70/pair. Easy install, and now each machine shows 24 cores in the activity monitor. I upgraded the graphics cards to Radeon RX580 Saphire Pulse cards w/8GB RAM ($130-150). Added 64GB RAM ($100). Purchased a PCIe to dual 2.5 SATA for a cheap SSD addition, and then used some large spinning drives for data storage. They work great. They handle whatever I want to do with audio. Video work is fine too. Chrome and Safari tabs abound. Right now I’m running High Sierra. I can run Mojave if I want, but things are stable where I’m at now. These towers were cheap, and upgrading was cheap too.
My only complaints with current setup? Gee, power consumption and heat is annoying but not a deal breaker. The handles dig into my hands when I move the machine. I don’t get a boot screen with the GPU I’m using. I could use another PCIe port. USB 3 would be nice without an expansion card.

I’ll probably stick with my current setups for a few more years. By then, I’ll move to some Mac Minis or something else. Maybe in 2029 I’ll start using one of these 2019 Mac Pros, since I am currently using a 2009 Mac Pro and it keeps me very happy.

Aside from the gear lust, it ain’t for me at this point given the price point but I commend Apple for announcing some pro-level hardware. I haven’t been excited for Apple hardware like this since the PowerMac G5 announcement!

8 Likes
#66

I think that’s last October’s model (a major upgrade itself) as nothing has been announced, but given that I’m probably buying one next month I hope you’re right!

#67

you might wanna wait because what I’m talking about is from a video from a YouTuber at WWDC, maybe they’re updating the specs with OSX Catalina

1 Like
#68

…and the essence of my original “then don’t [buy it]” comment was to preempt what seems to me an emotionally and ethically charged position on Apple - the company - that has little to do with the new product being rolled out - the Mac Pro. I’m sure you’d agree the product warrants evaluation on technical merit (of course it isn’t even on the market now).

short version: I agree that the facts are as you state them - they could have done more. But there’s no need to be bitter about their recent past, and to let that colour what deserves to be an objective assessment.

May I offer you that there’s a shape to “right to repair” - how do you repair a hard drive? How do you repair a display panel? What about a CPU? Many things you can only swap out. Same about security - say if there’s remote unsanctioned access to your machine in your absence via a hardware backdoor, can the T2-encrypted boot volume be accessed then? Can your secrets be extracted from the T2? Same about privacy - frankly it doesn’t matter who does the telemetry - they all do, they all get hacked eventually, but this company prefers to ship you stuff that only crunches meaning locally on your device, without engaging the cloud, so all that’s left is a single device’s understanding stored on the device itself, w/r/t secrets - hashes stored one way on a local chip - would you rather that chip was repairable? Sure, do see it as a vehicle to build trust to sell you a credit card, but it’s fair to acknowledge within the same breath that existing card transactions, yours and mine, are constantly data-mined as matter of normal course.

As @nojay says, it’s exciting hardware. Sure there’s ethics worth arguing about, and an idiotic display stand to offset the cost of the display, that’s not worth arguing about. I have no problem if my opinion is unpopular or is a bit technical and somewhat narrow - there are innovations in the hardware that I’m not even seeing discussed, and this time the assembled package bears all kinds of marks of a considered process, much more so than with the trashcan. We can probe it till the cows come home, but I still maintain nothing about it is unreasonable, and neither is the cost.

2 Likes
#69

Not trying to be contrarian, but I really can’t tell if you’re trolling me or not?

Of course I’m not going to buy it, it’s not my use case. My whole point about this has been that the Mac Pro offers a signpost of what Apple’s vision for the future might be w/r/t the rest of their hardware on both the macro and micro.

Based off the thousand dollar stand, the lack of NVIDIA support, etc, I don’t think this is an inspiring future for artists using Apple products, Mac Pro or otherwise.

I’m not sure we have the same understanding re: right to repair either. You are aware of the (thankfully yet to be implemented) ability of the T2 to brick your computer if serviced at a non-authorized shop?

Additionally, the keyboard and chassis design on the MBP requires an entire new top half to replace a single key, and users are aggressively discouraged from investigating options beyond blowing compressed air at their $1000+ investments.

These are not products worthy of the ‘Apple tax’ that I would have been happy to pay 4 years ago for inspiring, functional + elegant products, and the Mac Pro just seems like more empty cynicism from Apple tbh.

There are tons of different use cases for “pros” - say VR developers, mid-tier game designers, AV-artists etc, which are underserved by current options (Mac Mini +eGPU is the best I could think of, and even that’s a joke price/spec wise), and obviously over-served by the Mac Pro.

I take issue with you trying to dismiss real logistical concerns as ‘emotional’, and would note that they come from first-hand experience as a working educator, artist and sound designer for VR over the last four years, and these sentiments are echoed STRONGLY by virtually every single person I know in the NYC media arts community.

2 Likes
#70

I was holding out a little hope for the Mac Pro line. Like a few others in the thread, I seem to be just niche enough of a power user to not match up with the target demographic they seem to be going for.

As with all things Apple, I imagine this launch price is actually fairly, if not decently competitive with a pile of identical components in a box but it misses the mark for my needs the same as the 2013 trash can did.

I went hackinstosh a few years ago but have in the interim weaned myself off of anything Apple specific in preparation for this. Logic is crossgraded to Cubase Pro 10 now for example and I really don’t think sticking hackintosh or retaining apple will factor into my next upgrade cycle.

I’ll keep buying iPads until someone does it better though, which doesn’t look likely at the moment.

1 Like
#71

My case is not complicated: horsepower for Logic. Hundreds of Kontakt tracks and cpu-hungry plugs. I also edit in Final Cut and use Max/MSP, but neither of those push my current machine to the limit like I can in Logic (Mac Pro trashcan, 2013, pretty maxed out).

#72

From my understanding Apple doesn’t support Nvidia because Nvidia won’t open up their platform and allow MacOS to run closer to the “metal”. So as a response Apple has decided not to support them until they do. But since Nvidia is doing well they don’t really care and won’t do it. Though there are rumors that Apple is going to make it’s own GPU silicon, which we probably saw a preview with in this new Mac Pro (that after burner card). This would make sense since no one can touch their GPUs on mobile atm and intel has failed to deliver on chips on time.

1 Like
#73

From everything I’ve seen it’s been the other way around, and seems to be stemming from interpersonal issues from a previous gen MBP/GPU pairing?

Either way I’m praying they get it resolved - feel like it would be a huge boon, and great incentive to get back to the Apple camp!

For my own use case, its frustrating because its not just a matter of GPU specs, but a lot of fluid sims/particle shaders/AI things are either optimized for NVIDIA or straight up require it, which means I’m effectively locked out of using Apple for half my work, despite being willing to pay the apple tax because of how nice the OS is : (

#74

Perhaps run a slave system for kontakt which you stream the output of and in that instance you really don’t need a Mac just a bit of a custom PC and keep your Mac for DAW duties/plugs

#75

Someone mentioned adding HDD

#76

Game developer, sound post editor, music composer, web frontend developer, and until recently VR developer here. As a freelancer I hop between these, have been for a decade, and find myself best served by a desktop class macOS machine that is powerful and reliable. Hence typing this on a 6y old hackintosh (NVidia 10-series inside).

The argument I’m making is for the chassis, for the platform, and not for today, but over 5-10 years from now - we complained that the existing options were underpowered, weren’t expandable, serviceable, reconfigurable, and were getting long in the tooth. I still can’t see a decent argument for lower cost, or for this Mac Pro to be a different machine. In fact, the baseline configuration is not expensive enough to be a halo product.

I hear you loud and clear - you disagree to the idea of there even being an AST2/GSX. And, in a way, that the T2 inside has too much power for comfort. I’m interested in alternative ideas that don’t spiral into the loose PC hardware feel, and also maintain Apple’s ability to protect the customer (ideally taking out their ability to bar the user from using their machine)

So we must be hearing different things since I’ve found no echo here in London, at least in the video, music & post production community - everywhere I’ve seen powerful desktop class Macs, such concerns seemed to have been ignored in favour of productivity.

1 Like
#77

The fact that you’re writing the above from a hackintosh sort of proves the point I’m making here lol.

Think we’re going to have to agree to disagree. All the best–

#78

how so? I’d think twice about building another Hackintosh now that there’s an adequate Mac Pro. I was thinking about expanding my rig’s RAM to 32GB just because I can’t be bothered with another build. Does that prove there needs to be a different Mac product or somehow spell bleaker future? If yes then I fail to see how.

#79

Since you’ve already got a trash can, you should be able to fire up Activity Monitor or other performance analysis tools, set a bunch of stuff in motion, and get some insight into how the specific tools you’re using are and are not utilizing your system. Which software is scaling across cores efficiently? How is RAM utilization and storage looking? That info should be invaluable for prioritizing your next move.

4 Likes
#80

Something interesting for those on here that want to stay with macOS but they aren’t 100% sure on the new mac pro:

From what I have seen in Reddit/forums you barely loose performance, and actually sometimes even gain performance depending on the software you are using.

But the best thing is that unlike any normal hackintosh you can essentially run macOS on any hardware as long as you have a dedicated GPU and a motherboard that supports virtualisation (VTD/VTX/SVM). It is also a lot more stable than a normal hackintosh from what I have heard.

This video goes through the set-up you would have to go through. https://youtu.be/ATnpEOo3GJA

3 Likes
#82

Regarding the screen for the rest of us, last week I bought the revised 4k LG Ultrafine display from an Apple for less than the cost of the new stand. I absolutely love it, the colour replication on it has been great and it’s really nice on the eyes. The inbuilt thunderbolt hub is handling peripherals and audio interface and I’m able to switch it between mac and PC inputs with all the plugged in devices coming along for the ride. My only gripe is that it could use with some sort of onboard input switch and one less LG logo from the front of the frame, though it is subtle.