Mobenthey/Ciat-Lonbarde (synthmall) thread

Rodrigo · February 23, 2019, 11:00pm

I wanted to build something like that, but then realized the fret data would be pretty complicated to parse (at least my understanding of it).

I’d love to be able to turn the data back into information that shows what frets (and combinations of frets) are being pressed, and then making a UI around that.

The rest of the data (butts/barres) would be pretty simple methinks.

I made this aaaages ago:


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Jojo · February 23, 2019, 11:48pm

Thank you Rodrigo! This is perfect. I have a SHNTH as well…

Yes, I posted here because when realized that I needed do a good chunk of hours detective work on the fret data in order to have it do anything that would be easily described in a class environment. But a patch similar to yours above is what I’d like to have for the Shtar - and I’ll try to get there eventually! Will post here when I do. Thanks much again.

Rodrigo · February 23, 2019, 11:49pm

If you get something going, do post it on here. Or even if you figure out a bit of it, post it too and I’ll see if I can help out.

It’s been a bit since I look at it, but it looked like just a bit of maths and/or bit shifting (neither one of which is my strong suit!).

mlogger · February 24, 2019, 10:33am

I got some paper circuits PCBs made

Rodrigo · February 25, 2019, 8:10pm

Man, it’s such a joy building them on PCBs. I have a whole mess of paper-paper circuits and between the hole punching, and running cables for longer sections, it can get really exhausting and tedious. I’ve been a few from PCBs and it’s so much better, especially since they were largely designed to go on paper, so nothing is crowded, and everything is laid out in an aesthetically pleasing way.

Looks like you’ve printed some of the more esoteric ones, so curious how you get on with those.

mlogger · April 12, 2019, 1:39am

It was the Conrad papers stuff - swoops, rando, piezo preamps and dogvoice I was really interested in as i already had a Rollz5. I also printed out others that hadn’t been widely available before, like 5 Star Brain, Swoop Spokes and Esoterica. Interesting to see what they do. The paper circuits PCB schematics are available on the Ciat website. You just need to convert to Gerbers. Sharing is caring. For people wanting to do this, here is the info.

Thanks to @dianus for the help with duplicating the gerber layers and whose photo I used in this thread.

Heres how :

Paper circuits can be found here http://ciat-lonbarde.net/paper/ and here http://www.ciat-lonbarde.net/TIMARACURRICULUM/TIMARATERIALS/cirques/index.html

Paper Circuits master legend here : Mobenthey/Ciat-Lonbarde (synthmall) thread

How to make Ciat Lonbarde paper circuits PCB’s.

These PCB’s are double layer with solder pads on the top and bottom :
download Peter B’s PCBs:
http://www.ciat-lonbarde.net/TIMARACURRICULUM/TIMARATERIALS/cirques/papers.zip
You will need to rename these files to .osm files for it to read.
Download this (Mac only) software https://www.osmondpcb.com/download.html
Open any of the .osm files that you have in that program.
After opening you need to export to Gerber file.
File - Export - Gerber Files
Press OK.
You get a message that says “Not all paths connected” just ignore and Press OK again.
Goto the folder were it’s exported (it will be in the same directory as your .osm files
and in a folder for example “GerberFiles_conrad_preamp”
Inside it are lots of little Gerber doc - they need modding from single layer to double layer.
Using a file manager (not Osmond) - duplicate layer 1, and mask 1 and rename them layer 2, mask 2 and add the proper extensions as per photo attached. Change all extensions of other files as per photo.
Zip that folder up.
I recommend you check the Gerber front side and backside in any free Gerber viewer first to check for any mistakes.
That zip is what you send to the pcb manufacturer.
I used www.JLCPCB.com
But you can use any.
Theres a review site at pcbshopper.com to choose which manufacturer you want to use.

If you know how to use Osmond I would also recommend you add mounting holes in the corners. Rollz6 also has an error - the 1uf non hairy capacitor is pictured the wrong way round.

mlogger · February 26, 2019, 1:09am

Regarding the Deerhorn and these unknown parts from top to bottom they are :

Choke Inductor. Theres 2 on the board - one is 1mH the other 10mh
0.0001uf capacitor
1N4001 diode
Photoresistor - any value
Adjustable Antenna / Variable inductor, not sure of the value

renegog · February 26, 2019, 2:55am

mobenthey users ! (is the thread title misspelled on purpose? if so… that feels on brand lol EDIT: someone fixed it lol) I’m thinking about the denum as a primarily an lfo and stereo attenuator in a small system, can anyone speak to this use – I know it can do LFO range, but curious peoples generally feeling abt using it like that (sidebar: if you FM a square wave LFO with e.g. a triangle LFO, do you get a ratcheting up-and-down gate sequence?). also i think i understand in theory the left-rite dynamic of sending both signals to the side thats higher in amplitude – is that interesting in stereo aurally or is it the kind of thing you just have as two channels mixing to mono down chain?

yoyosandshoes · February 26, 2019, 4:41am

Wrt the VCAs, I almost always pan the audio which I think fits with the aesthetic of the Ciat instruments like Coco for example which has the audio hard panned. I only mix them down if I can’t help it for some other reason. Having said that, mixed to mono is interesting too - depending on the sound sources and modulation all sorts of happy accidents occur.
I haven’t used Denum in LFO range as I have only had it in one patch that I’ve been using live for some months now. I am using it, unusually, as a 1v/oct sound source. I can get it to track over an octave which is sufficient for the purpose and it has a wonderfully haunted and pained quality to it. I have a tuner plugged into one of the outputs permanently and tune it as I go because of its drift
I’m not sure about your question re FM because you modulate the bounds and bounce and I haven’t had any predictable results which is the beauty really.

Rodrigo · February 26, 2019, 6:22am

Looking forward to your vids of these!

I’ve been curious about a bunch of them, and did a bunch fo research trying to figure out the early deerhorn paper circuits (back when I made that “Master Legend” document), but never got around to building anything past the ‘first four’ designs.

Fuck yeah, I’ll update the document, though not sure where is a good central repo for it. I think I uploaded the original one to the yahoo group, but that seems dead now.

renegog · February 26, 2019, 6:34am

very cool! i guess fm is probably the wrong way of thinking about it, cool that it does well within a range i can imagine it sounds quite nice based on the demos i’ve heard ^ _ ^ really enjoying your soundcloud right now!

mlogger · February 26, 2019, 7:39am

if you are on facebook there is a Ciat Lonbarde paper circuits group https://m.facebook.com/groups/272678510166598 and theres a regular Ciat Lonbarde group https://m.facebook.com/groups/375204516010351

Rodrigo · February 26, 2019, 8:42am

Not on Facebook. Could you (re)post the updated one there?

I’ll post it on MW too.

mlogger · February 26, 2019, 11:33am

Ok, yes will do. A wise choice, not being on Facebook

Cementimental · February 26, 2019, 12:42pm

Thanks very much for this info, will definitely give it a go some time

sbaio · February 26, 2019, 5:44pm

Awesome, thanks for the write-up! Very curious about the paper circuits, will have to do some reading on them. Those PCBs look beautiful!

dianus · February 27, 2019, 2:28am

I was looking at the paper circuits in Osmond and it took me a little bit but I’ve been able to import the gerbers into kiCAD. One useful tip is to make sure to have the right extensions the various board layers

52612808_10216770405584878_3896746397990387712_n

You want to select the board outline, which I’ve found is usually on layer one and cut and paste it onto aux 1. output extension .gm1 so it’s recognized as an edge.cut file

One thing people have pointed out is most of the Osmond layouts are single sided, which many board houses have a minimum 2 layer design rules. You can just duplicate layer 1, and mask 1 and rename them layer 2, mask 2 and add the proper extensions

dianus · February 27, 2019, 2:37am

Has anyone built the deerhorn spyral? I was looking at it in osmond/kicad, and noticed the antenna is made from alternating traces on layer 1, and 2. Output the original file, it creates a kind of star pattern. Traces arranged onto the same layer in kicad, it creates a more continuos spiral:

Is there anyone who’s worked on this who knows which is intended?

Rodrigo · February 27, 2019, 3:08pm

I’ve not worked with those circuits specifically, but in the shnth, you are meant to weave the antenna wire through like that, so I’m guessing it’s a similar idea.

Jojo · March 2, 2019, 10:11pm

I have another potentially dumb Q for the group:

I’d like to have a signal path that goes Shtar into Cocoquantus into Norns - use a volume pedal for final stereo to PA - but I want to have the ability to turn the delays of the Coco up and down separately from the input level…

I have a Moog Expression pedal (this one: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/EP3--moog-ep-3-universal-polarity-expression-pedal) - has anyone had success converting an exp pedal like this into banana and feeding it into the Cocoquantus?

How else could I accomplish this?