Pre-release & Ordering Hype Megathread (archive)

ghostclub · 2023-05-13T22:27:21.995Z

The modulation is to me the most exciting aspect (sorry, couldn’t resist the pun). The ability to use feedback and modulation to alter the physical vibrations, with enough control to modulate the fundamental and overtones independently, is what’s really great about this. It’s also designed to allow direct physical interaction with the tines, opening up a whole world of prepared techniques. I hope the latter makes it into one of the finished instruments, or they make it easy enough to hack the design.

karst · 2023-05-13T22:38:54.919Z

timp:

But am I right thinking that unlike a Fender Rhodes they are not striking the tines per se, they are exciting them (& modulating them) as per the thread on Lines about making a large scale eBow

(all of this is based off not that much information, so maybe some of it is wrong)

yes, there’s no physical strike, but it’s still different from an ebow in a few ways.

the mention of piano hammer (as mentioned in the video) is instructive because of how it works. it strikes, falls away, and the sound decays. it produces a lot of initial force, but the sustain has to come from the actual element being struck (and however that element is then communicating it’s vibration).

an ebow works like a violin bow, where the initial energy doesn’t have to be very intense because the energy going into the string is continuous. in an actual violin it’s just the actual bowing, in an ebow it’s the push and pull of the string that builds and then sustains.

in this instrument, the ‘acoustic’ mode is more like a piano hammer (in acoustic behavior, not physical), but the ‘synthesizer’ mode uses that initial ‘strike’ and feeds it back into that note with the ability to isolate and amplify (or phase cancel) certain overtone behaviors in the physical resonator. so there’s still an initial burst of energy, followed by a sustain tone that can be modulated. it seems like maybe there was an instance of a single strike on one resonator being turned into a sustained note that tracked pitch over further notes on the keyboard (basically legato), but i might be remembering that wrong, but if so that means that the feedback loop might be able to travel across the keyboard.

glia · 2023-05-13T23:35:30.116Z

hey i could be wrong but the description here seems to indicate that ongoing energy can be fed into the tines and, perhaps, the hammer strike was an exaggerated metaphor to help visualize one facet of a process that is (or can be) much more subtle:

How is the resonator made to vibrate?

Very much like in a piano, we hit it with a hammer. Except our hammer is electromagnetic. In technical terms, the scheme we use is called balanced armature, where the resonator is magnetised by a coil to make it move. This allows us to continuously supply energy to the resonators, even when they are in motion.

How are the vibrations turned into signals?

It’s very similar to how a condenser microphone turns vibrations of a diaphragm into a signal. In our case the diaphragm is the resonator and it sits in air close to some plates held at about 50 volts. Any movement of the resonator causes a small change in the plate voltage. This small change is the signal we want and it contains the beautiful voice of the resonator…

How are the signals used?

The signals from the resonators are fed into a feedback system. Here we compare the live signal from the resonator with a target signal we are hoping to achieve. The result of this comparison is fed back to the balanced armature driver, allowing us to compensate for any mismatch between the two signals. This allows us to maintain the electronic control over the resonators while letting them really sing out their beautiful voices.

karst · 2023-05-13T23:57:10.431Z

oh, no question that the device can act both as a hammer and a bow, i’m just going off of the fact that the speed of the attack and the way the overall sound envelope of the ‘acoustic’ mode sounds would indicate that it’s behaving more like a hammer than an ebow is capable of.

part of that is also to do with the actual resonator looks to be a lot more flexible than a guitar string, so it doesn’t have as much inertia to get vibrating.

eblomquist · 2023-05-14T00:05:54.691Z

I know that Korg doesn’t have access to any secret society mystical physics universe, but this feels pretty unprecedented to me. Am I crazy?

karst · 2023-05-14T00:11:43.352Z

in a lot of ways, this thing is highly precedented. all of the physical dynamics have existed in instruments for 80+ years and there are also other feedback instruments, like the Tilde Elektriske Fjaerlett that use a lot of the same ideas arranged (very) differently.

it is obviously an innovative thing, though. the willingness to experiment and make something (anything) electro-acoustic today along with developing the modulation system (which does seem like a first, afaik) is certainly brave, and i really hope to see this make it into musician’s hands.

glia · 2023-05-14T00:17:38.238Z

they seem pretty confident that this will lead to real products and i’m equally excited to see electric wind instruments that Korg teased

electronic control of an air column instead of tines will be wild!

eblomquist:

I know that Korg doesn’t have access to any secret society mystical physics universe, but this feels pretty unprecedented to me. Am I crazy?

Nope, kinda like what @karst said…i was interested anyway but initially bristled at the “acoustic synthesis” label being touted as innovative

it really is a unique twist and i actually find it remarkable that they found an angle combining existing (and honestly traditional) tech to forge something new

Starthief · 2023-05-14T00:45:24.153Z

The potential for this seems really neat… I can imagine isolating vibration modes in a cymbal and getting different pure tones out of it. Or an electronic daxophone

RasThavas · 2023-05-14T02:07:48.669Z

This Korg acoustic synthesis reminds me of the Moog Guitar and later the Vos Guitar, they were able to have some amazing control over a vibrating string, so I would not be surprised to see this develop into something with much greater sonic breadth and control.

fuzboxz · 2023-05-14T05:04:56.852Z

Interesting, my first idea was that they take the signal, find the fundamentals via FFT and just resynthesize the fundamental frequency with pure sine waves. (which would explain why it is monophonic at the moment)

darylc · 2023-05-14T11:13:13.081Z

The concept and workings of the Korg Acoustic synth are absolutely amazing. Taking the most basic form of creating a tuned note and pushing it as far as possible must be applauded.

The prototype sounds & possibilities of playing in a prepared piano style is amazing.

glia:

How is the resonator made to vibrate?

Very much like in a piano, we hit it with a hammer. Except our hammer is electromagnetic. In technical terms, the scheme we use is called balanced armature, where the resonator is magnetised by a coil to make it move. This allows us to continuously supply energy to the resonators, even when they are in motion.

So balanced armatures are in a nut shell “speakers” they are used extensivley in ear monitors with additional dynamic coils to tune the IEM response.

So if the “hammer” is a speaker, you can effectively make it do any movement a speaker can perform.

It would be unbeliveably great if they incorporated CV control over the armatures. Full polyphony would be achievable too because each note is obviously a physical thing…

eblomquist:

I know that Korg doesn’t have access to any secret society mystical physics universe, but this feels pretty unprecedented to me. Am I crazy?

I think all the concepts and technology exist to create this, it’s just a matter of time and how much time & resources can you spend on something without requiring or wanting anything in return.

Tatsuya Takahashi has done some job convincing Korg to give him a lab in Berlin, although he’s made them that much money from his commercial projects for them it sure made it easier.

Honestly I can’t wait to see what results from this and with big bro Korg’s commerical manufacuring, it could/should be widely available for a reasonable price.

fuzboxz · 2023-05-14T12:18:02.921Z

Super pumped about this. The sample to wavetable synthesis is crazy. I’ll probably use this feature a lot.

TanaBarbier · 2023-05-14T12:54:16.559Z

Has this been posted ?

It is crazy and brilliant IMO.

Catchthehare · 2023-05-14T13:25:24.791Z

1U Tape Looper, seriously impressive modular spirit here

mdoudoroff · 2023-05-14T13:29:11.501Z

This 1U modular tape machine concept is the most fabulous kind of crazy.

Thhhh · 2023-05-14T14:02:55.685Z

I love this concept.

hundreadP · 2023-05-14T14:04:31.808Z

I have to correct my previous ideas about 2023 superbooth :: this is the best one!
This energy and enthusiasm is super mega awesome. Also the whole presentation - british accent, ic-pinout T-shirt overhanging rudrashka mala.

What else to ask?

I hope he likes pineapple on pizza.

Sandpalaces · 2023-05-14T14:52:33.496Z

This has me so hyped! It looks like it may be exactly what I’ve been looking for, can’t wait for more details to come out

whatisvalis · 2023-05-14T15:19:07.367Z

Wow - what a star - I love the passion and ideas. There was so much to unpack in that video.

I’m down for a 1U tape loop - i wish there were more 84/104hp 1U modules.

hundreadP · 2023-05-14T15:19:43.741Z

I hope Befaco would came up tape loop ““loop=all-around=my-eurorack=case”” compatible KNURLIES.

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