Pre-release & Ordering Hype Megathread (archive)

dani_derks · 2023-12-31T16:24:37.188Z

bawww, thank you @coreyr for the boost <333

in case more detail is interesting

hills has been an open secret for almost three years. like all my scripts, it is an improvisation through code – the idea takes on new form and light every time i sit down with it, but also every time i reflect on Milford Graves (cannot recommend Full Mantis enthusiastically enough) or listen to a Church Andrews + Matt Davies collab or rewatch @Galapagoose’s ssensse for the nth time in a decade.

the sound-making side of hills (a SuperCollider engine called kildare) has gone through a number of changes over the years – its height was a bunch of 2-operator-FM-with-feedback voices that were modeled after the Machinedrum’s EFM machine, with a stereo delay / three-channel feedback matrix / final-stage shelving EQ. the latter bit has been broken off into an upcoming norns script and engine called kildareFX. the voices will make it into an eventual norns version of hills, but all my focus is on wrapping up a MIDI-only first release for seamstress.

in the stream last night, i used kildareFX on the first two pieces (re-processing some recordings from 2019, in honor of the ‘loopy self-reference’ theme) and used hills to generate a bunch of temporally-related-but-rhythmically-opinionated MIDI patterns for the other four pieces. the data streams only transmit when their associated keys are held, which gives useful control over the flow. the MIDI was sent to Bitwig’s Sampler instrument, which is incredible, cycling through chops from Nate Smith’s bananas-rad new sample pack and some other recordings of mine from 2019.

hills frustratingly toes the line between automatic music and ten pounds of freshly-boiled spaghetti thrown onto the wall. i recorded all the performance audio in that video last Tuesday, which was a wild process of both asking myself what the hell i had spent the last three years working on and finding the exact zones i had started this weird process in search of. i have absolutely no idea if playing it is going to land for anybody else, which is why i’ve felt free to be a little relentless in changing focus and gears so many times with its design. three years is far too long to keep something, though, so i’ll be letting it free very soon – i hope the use of it clicks with some of y’all as oddly-deep as it has with me

fastlanestranger · 2023-12-31T21:15:00.833Z

Intelligence combined with kindness is such an incredible superpower.

bobbcorr · 2024-01-01T05:09:16.560Z

Happy New Year, you glorious pre-release hypers! Love to all and all for love.

anon60283851 · 2024-01-01T11:20:10.181Z

Is it OK to start pre-release hyping 2025 already?

I think 2023 is getting old by now and didn’t sound too good anyway, plus was riddled with bugs. This new 2024 thing seems kinda promising and I might buy into it, even though all we’ve got is irritatingly vague teasers so far - and only yearfluencers seem to have it properly in their hands yet. But wow, 2025…

Edit: if I may rant a bit, I hate that they get locked us to these compulsory yearly upgrades though. I wish I could just stay in 2018 until there’s an objectively better version out.

opti_prime · 2024-01-01T13:25:21.942Z

With hindsight I preferred 2020

xmacex · 2024-01-01T14:34:04.215Z

Given that the OP says

tehn:

this thread is also for ordering hype

I presume this is also the correct thread to be e-x-c-i-t-e-d about that I have made a quasi-order for a second hand Mutable Instument Blinds with someone selling theirs. A local pickup should be happening hopefully in two weeks!

A four-channel, four quadrant multiplier, ie voltage controlled, bipolar attenuverter seems like a nice step for me with my small modular system, to weird it up from a dual channel VCA I currently have. After surveying options of what a) exist b) functionality per cash and c) is available on second hand and weighing alternatives like A*B+C, MISO, ModDemix, A-114 etc, the Blinds seems like good choice. It will be able to serve AM, ring modulation, mixing and summing, VCA, output, and CV knobs duties.

So far I think I’ve seen all the videos about amplitude modulation and ring modulation of YouTube, and all the like three about this specific Blinds module. Do you do this too?

What has been fun is testing feasibility and prototyping some future ideas in VCV and plugdata, mirroring my system which is built around Maths (which is substituted by Rampage in my VCV setup), µO_c, Żłob Entropy, Stackcables and crow of course with norns. The Blinds in the middle here ↓

hypithering800×378 34.2 KB

patch in VCV, simulating Maths+Blinds duo

Bildschirmfoto 2024-01-01 um 16.42.592536×1534 378 KB

tip-zip.vcv (1.4 KB)

Exciting! :dancing_banana:

informationsource · 2024-01-01T15:32:09.784Z

You’ve made a fantastic choice. Blinds has long been one of my favourite MI modules. Do note that it’s not simple to silence audio with it completely, if that’s a goal.

My favourite “trick” with it, not much of one, is to take advantage of the offset voltage normalled to the big knob and to plug any signal I wish to wrangle into the CV input. Not sure if there’s a video of that, I think I read it in a post somewhere, perhaps here.

(Whether it counts as pre-release or not, I’m hyped for anybody who can get a reasonably priced Mutable module at this point in time, as mad as I am that this is a rare occurrence.)

xmacex · 2024-01-01T15:59:14.359Z

Cheers!

oh the self-serving audacity of parsing conditional sentences

I took the liberty to parse the & in the thread title as

(Pre-release) & (Ordering) (Hype Megathread)

rather than

(Pre-release & Ordering) (Hype Megathread)

and therefore interpret it legit to get hyped up about second hand orders too =}

Blinds seems like a good Maths friend, I added my VCV patch above if anybody wants to mess around with Blinds (“quad VC polarizer”) knobs… and join my excitement!!! Anything is a legit “trick” if it something interesting happens. I’ll certainly make use of it, thank you!

Starthief · 2024-01-01T16:12:18.086Z

informationsource:

Blinds has long been one of my favourite MI modules. Do note that it’s not simple to silence audio with it completely, if that’s a goal.

If you want to use it as a VCA for audio with a unipolar envelope CV, you can patch the envelope into the main input and audio into the CV input. No audio will “leak” when the envelope is at 0V.

(You still want to keep the big knob centered because it will add a DC offset to the signal, but a slight offset is usually less noticeable and often filtered out. Where I wouldn’t do this would be with an FM modulator signal, where you’re probably better off with the “leak” than an offset.)

…

I’ll be upgrading my Mystic Circuits Ana to Ana 2, which adds bipolar VCA inputs and a mix output as well as a couple other new things. So I’m also contemplating switching out my Blinds for a similar-ish utility, but there are always tradeoffs.

Toppobrillo Cluster would be more convenient for crossfading, which I do quite a lot of.

Warm Star The Bends is interesting. Not the most straightforward approach for many cases, that’s for sure. I’m trying to wrap my head around whether certain things are even possible with it… it seems like it makes some simple functions more unintuitive while also making some less common but interesting things easy to work with. Hmm.

And there’s always Cold Mac. I like the cross-panning it can do…

xmacex · 2024-01-01T16:56:11.886Z

Starthief:

“leak”

It’s a very fine line between “leak” and “generative” innit Hyped for exploring this VCA/attenuverter stuff! And viscerally understanding how important offset is.

HappyHands · 2024-01-01T17:44:42.505Z

I’d be surprised and disappointed if the s-4 is just another lemon drop. That was a $400 device and I just ended using granulator 2 half the time because it was a lot faster to get a sample into it for the same or better results.

The s-4 appears to have a ton more depth to it, but we shall see. I am not a huge fan of granular after trying to fit it into my music for a year or so. My idea for the s-4 is kind of weird but I envision it as a modern,sample based jd990 where I can layer unique sounds and pads. I don’t know if that will be worth it or not but it’s an idea. Or I’ll just buy an overpriced jd-990.

As for the s-1 not having a screen. Thank god for that. I don’t need one. It’s a very very musical device that is very easy to navigate by ear. It rewards a basic understanding of theory - punch in chords or scales and get results. Maybe get wild and try a different scale besides Ionian over that major chord or dial in a different groove on the hihat opposed to the off beat snare.

I like a sequencer that rewards exploration outside of a groove template slapped on everything and all then it’s locked to Dorian mode, but that’s just me. The t-1s default scales are very cool in that regard. You get a major minor and minor pent and then it gets exotic. I love that.

I’m expecting that level of quirky sophistication in the s-4 and anything torso releases because they have demonstrated with the t-1 that they think on a different level than a lot of gear makers.

Xylr · 2024-01-03T18:07:06.093Z

The s-4 looks cool but

@HappyHands wrote:

I am not a huge fan of granular after trying to fit it into my music for a year or so.

I’m feeling this lately. Last year I sent the tracks for an album that I eventually self-released on Bandcamp to the person who runs a label I really admire, and he’s a very talented artist himself. His feedback was polite enough but he said it sounded like I’d “just discovered granular synthesis” and asked, “now what are you going to do with it?”

I’ve used various granular stuff for around 20 years, so that stung a bit. But it made me think, what does it sound like to be talented and creative with granular synthesis today? I’m not sure I know, and I think granular on its own sounds a bit uncreative actually (not meant to be a hot take), like a stand-in for more creative approaches. I’m sure there are plenty of people using it in super interesting and novel ways. I’m just not sure I am one of them, and for the time being I am looking at tools that, for better and (sometimes much) worse, ask more of me to get pleasing sounding results.

anon60283851 · 2024-01-03T18:26:55.676Z

The S-4 advance hype seems to get caught on the granular aspect a lot, like “oh, another granular instrument, I wonder if it’s like x”. Perhaps due to their marketing material or there not being enough hw granular synths in the world yet? While what they advertise as the initial feature set is:

4 parallel stereo audio tracks
Tape player with live looping capabilities
Polyphonic sample player

Live granular processing with time-warping and pitch-shifting algorithms

Morphing resonator (48-band filter bank)
Bit crushing, drive, and compression
Combined reverb and delay with pitch-shifting and shimmer

4 modulators per track
Modulate any parameter of the audio engine
Modulator types:
– Complex LFOs
– Generative sequencing tools
– Envelopes

…

With modulator cross-modulation + unlimited mod targets, apparently “enough” polyphony (at least I think they claimed something like that elsewhere), and so on.

I’m not saying whether it’s going to be worth the money or interest for someone, with or without that one particular aspect, just that it seems there might be more sides to it than “a granular instrument”. Whatever they are in practise, will be interesting to see once it’s out and people get to try it out properly.

naxuu · 2024-01-03T19:24:03.514Z

Xylr:

His feedback was polite enough but he said it sounded like I’d “just discovered granular synthesis” and asked, “now what are you going to do with it?”

Ouch. This reads as neither polite nor fair to me. Particularly in a world where most (70% from a quick google) are using presets, and likely sample packs too. The processes and techniques you use tend to matter only to yourself and a very rarified group of other musicians who pick up on those processes and techniques. For everyone else, I think quite arguably the more important metrics are: what exactly are you trying to express or explore - like, about the human experience? Is that compelling or worth exploring in itself? And if so, how successful were you at that expression/exploration?

Not to push back on this fellow too much. I have no idea who he is or which impressive label he runs. But he sounds like someone who has truly lost the forest for the trees re: this whole music thing and what we’re all doing with it (to be fair, a common malady that inflicts electronic musicians).

s_hamann · 2024-01-03T19:33:42.885Z

naxuu:

Xylr:

His feedback was polite enough but he said it sounded like I’d “just discovered granular synthesis” and asked, “now what are you going to do with it?”

Ouch. This reads as neither polite nor fair to me.

It’s definitely striking! I understand it might prove untoward to say who said it, but I would love to know. My initial reaction was that it was remarkably arrogant, but then that might depend on how it was said since it’s also great advice. Sometimes harsh words are just what you need, some things people have said to me years ago that stung have been the most valuable. And as it pertains to granular and the S4, it’s worthwhile always asking when using any technique or new machine what you hope to get from it.

monopole · 2024-01-03T19:35:18.156Z

I agree.

It’s never about the technique unless it’s the artist intention to highlight the process.
The outcome it’s nor better nor worse because of that.
The goal should be to express yourself, or to appeal to a certain audience, which is totally valid too.

Sidiblue · 2024-01-03T19:48:02.465Z

So, please remember that granular is really a small part of S-4. I don’t understand why many people focus on this aspect of an instrument that is presented as being a “sculpting sampler”. Then the discussion on granular synthesis is very interesting. Without wanting to be mean or haughty, but I am unable to name a group or musician whose use of granularity impressed me. At the same time I think that like reverb, when you hear it, there’s too much of it. Maybe it’s a question of dosage or something else, I don’t know. I’m also very attracted to the granular but often I don’t incorporate that into my production because I either find myself useless or not convinced by the result. I think it’s a super interesting topic. On a personal basis and without particularly wanting to defend the musician/label manager that I don’t know and I don’t care if I know. When we are asked for an opinion or a criticism it is always complicated. I tend to be very hard on myself and on others, but often out of intellectual honesty above all. I sincerely believe that a justified and well placed criticism can always bring something interesting. We can treat it or at least try to pay attention to the form but personally the harsh critics have always helped me and if it “stings” us it is because it has touched on something deep and which we already suspect. Questioning yourself is courageous and saving. I think that our ego only accepts criticism from certain people for whom we have respect and consideration, so I find that the process started is very holy on the contrary and will necessarily be positive.

Xylr · 2024-01-03T19:55:14.283Z

I felt like it was basically fair feedback tbh, and I found it helpful. I’d rather not say who it was though. I guess without context it may have not sounded polite, but it was.

They made further points about granular being relatively ubiquitous now, as a guitar is to rock music–just a tool, not an end–and suggested developing the composition further so that the end result was not as dependent upon the artefacts of the process. That’s a subjective take, but it resonates with me generally and about my own work in particular. I felt like I had done that with these songs, but it’s natural that others might not feel the same way. They ended wishing me well finding a home for the work, and invited me to send further music in the future. In the end, it did mess with my confidence a bit, and like I said I wound up self-releasing after not hearing back from 2 other labels (btw, I think self-releasing is great).

After the initial knock, I felt like integrating that feedback has helped me to make better choices, when I can be a bit more objective about it. Beyond that, it’s just super rare, in my experience, to get honest, useful, critical (good or bad) feedback, and that’s very valuable.

Sorry for totally derailing the thread!

smonthms · 2024-01-03T19:56:37.266Z

Was it Dr Dre? Guy can be a real ass.

fastlanestranger · 2024-01-03T20:08:56.568Z

His full legal name is actually Doctor Granular Dre so I’d trust him on this one.