Pre-release & Ordering Hype Megathread (archive)

Sidiblue · 2024-01-03T19:48:02.465Z

So, please remember that granular is really a small part of S-4. I don’t understand why many people focus on this aspect of an instrument that is presented as being a “sculpting sampler”. Then the discussion on granular synthesis is very interesting. Without wanting to be mean or haughty, but I am unable to name a group or musician whose use of granularity impressed me. At the same time I think that like reverb, when you hear it, there’s too much of it. Maybe it’s a question of dosage or something else, I don’t know. I’m also very attracted to the granular but often I don’t incorporate that into my production because I either find myself useless or not convinced by the result. I think it’s a super interesting topic. On a personal basis and without particularly wanting to defend the musician/label manager that I don’t know and I don’t care if I know. When we are asked for an opinion or a criticism it is always complicated. I tend to be very hard on myself and on others, but often out of intellectual honesty above all. I sincerely believe that a justified and well placed criticism can always bring something interesting. We can treat it or at least try to pay attention to the form but personally the harsh critics have always helped me and if it “stings” us it is because it has touched on something deep and which we already suspect. Questioning yourself is courageous and saving. I think that our ego only accepts criticism from certain people for whom we have respect and consideration, so I find that the process started is very holy on the contrary and will necessarily be positive.

Xylr · 2024-01-03T19:55:14.283Z

I felt like it was basically fair feedback tbh, and I found it helpful. I’d rather not say who it was though. I guess without context it may have not sounded polite, but it was.

They made further points about granular being relatively ubiquitous now, as a guitar is to rock music–just a tool, not an end–and suggested developing the composition further so that the end result was not as dependent upon the artefacts of the process. That’s a subjective take, but it resonates with me generally and about my own work in particular. I felt like I had done that with these songs, but it’s natural that others might not feel the same way. They ended wishing me well finding a home for the work, and invited me to send further music in the future. In the end, it did mess with my confidence a bit, and like I said I wound up self-releasing after not hearing back from 2 other labels (btw, I think self-releasing is great).

After the initial knock, I felt like integrating that feedback has helped me to make better choices, when I can be a bit more objective about it. Beyond that, it’s just super rare, in my experience, to get honest, useful, critical (good or bad) feedback, and that’s very valuable.

Sorry for totally derailing the thread!

smonthms · 2024-01-03T19:56:37.266Z

Was it Dr Dre? Guy can be a real ass.

fastlanestranger · 2024-01-03T20:08:56.568Z

His full legal name is actually Doctor Granular Dre so I’d trust him on this one.

adaherb · 2024-01-03T22:13:04.826Z

Xylr:

self-released on Bandcamp

I’m enjoying your release a lot . I like the sound of granular and you yield it well. I like the pacing of the tracks and your sound selection is sensitive.

muscat · 2024-01-03T22:51:56.284Z

have to echo others that I’m also enjoying your album! thanks for sharing it. I think the topics of granular technique and constructive feedback (it can be really hard to find people who give valuable feedback, especially in the realm of experimental music) are worth discussing more. Namelessness might be a good home <3

loooops · 2024-01-06T05:28:54.231Z

Can’t decide if this is amazing or insane but either way I’m hyped to see people use this thing.

Stylophone Theremin

ModulationStation · 2024-01-06T10:33:07.095Z

Sidiblue:

So, please remember that granular is really a small part of S-4. I don’t understand why many people focus on this aspect of an instrument that is presented as being a “sculpting sampler”.

In my case, most of the videos I have watched on the S4 incorporate some form of granular manipulation. It’s not a criticism of the S4 itself, as I do think it is a device that has many great features and of course it stands on its own.

I just got a Chompi and what makes it fun is this sort of granular blurring effect that then lets you craft beautiful textures that can be used as chords quickly. There is no doubt the S4 does much more than the Chompi, but it’s an example of why my interest in the S4 will be in comparing it against other things I have in the granular sampling realm.

I already have a GR Mega on preorder and I want to see how the two size up against each other. The GR Mega is also four layers and does many other things as well besides just being a powerful granular device.

anon60283851 · 2024-01-06T10:53:31.125Z

FWIW GR Mega seems like something dangerously approaching GRM Tools in a box, while S-4 seems like a performance mangling sampler with basic granular processing / synthesis as one of the core techs.

Not to say “obviously they’re going to be different” or anything arrogant like that, because neither of them is out yet and they have a lot of similarities too, but based on what’s known now, at least GR Mega pretty obviously wins for the granular and frequency domain processing power.

Sidiblue · 2024-01-06T11:46:32.112Z

@ModulationStation I understand your point of view. I will reformulate my point. Moving towards the S-4 based on its presumed granular capabilities may disappoint many people. At best, I tell myself that the granular is the bonus side of the instrument. It’s like buying an Op1 only for its sampling capabilities. After that, it’s only a modest point of view, everyone does as he wants. I reacted because at one point I found strange the comparisons of the S-4 with eurorack instruments or modules dedicated to the granular.

anon60283851 · 2024-01-06T13:20:19.065Z

Without still knowing how good, capable and fun the forthcoming Torso will be in practise, the OP-1 was a comparison I was thinking as well earlier. Not because of possible vague feature similarities (“tape”), but simply because it looks like it might combine a lot of interesting things to a package that looks to be easy and convenient to use, without any one of those things being necessarily better than the competitors, and the value being in being a cohesive fun instrument rather than eg. “a better granular synth than x”.

FWIW inb4 I realize the depth of pre-release hype and assumptions about something that doesn’t exist in finished and released form is getting pretty ridiculous. So as a disclaimer, still just sharing random conjectures / thoughts that have come to my mind while waiting for the instrument to actually come out and reviews to pour in.

monopole · 2024-01-06T13:23:42.157Z

Sidiblue:

I found strange the comparisons of the S-4 with eurorack instruments or modules dedicated to the granular

Doesn’t look strange to me when it seems to be the main attractor for most (at least of what I’ve read so far) and the most discussed part.
Torso focusing on it on their demos also favors this perspective.

It’s no mystery that ‘granular’ label catches everyone’s attention these days.
I find interesting that for example Slate&Ash Spectres doesn’t mention granular at all in their engine description, but a “collage” engine, setting themselves apart from the mandatory granular engine comparison. I think this is a smart marketing approach and helps them to present the engine as a whole, opposite of what happens with S-4.

Sidiblue · 2024-01-06T13:33:23.884Z

@monopole I may be too factual in my approach. Referring to the product’s web page, I do not find that the granular aspect is specially highlighted. It is also true that Torso’s communication is quite frustrating like other brands. The opportunity to exchange and discuss their discord allowed me to overcome this bad experience. You fully agree to also emphasize that the term granular is very attractive to most of us. In any case, the first pre-order batch is finished so there is a certain interest in their product.

Shiftr · 2024-01-06T13:42:16.253Z

anon60283851:

the OP-1 was a comparison I was thinking as well

I also think/hope this is a good comparison.
What I like about the idea of the S-4 is the combination of granular with a tape function. This is how I normally use granular. I record it while mangling sounds. And then I’ll use some favourite parts. Seems like I could do that on the S-4 and keep it all in that box.
OP-1 + much more radical soundesign.

fastlanestranger · 2024-01-06T14:26:48.488Z

As an anecdotal study of 1, I preordered the S-4 and its granular engine is the thing I’m least excited about. Not to say I’m not interested in it, but of all its features, granular functionality is at the bottom of the list.

0x1F433 · 2024-01-06T17:53:25.668Z

I’m sorry to join the "demos disappointed me’ crowd.

The part where torso says you have (only) 2 play modes: looper and midi play.

I’m running so tired of loop-oriented gear that having only these 2 options seems really wasted potential. I guess I’m also part of the crowd that wanted an intuitive 4-track audio recorder arranger with mangling potential.

P1505 · 2024-01-06T20:31:50.645Z

Off topic I know but given the brains on this forum surely we can design and manufacture our own dream machines?

Code, cad, and GUI:UI are my bag.

anon60283851 · 2024-01-06T20:42:35.901Z

We do have the Norns, of course, which quite a few forum members have made things for! (inb4 obvious UI restrictions without auxiliary connected devices and so on, naturally)

s_hamann · 2024-01-06T21:33:16.063Z

0x1F433:

I’m sorry to join the "demos disappointed me’ crowd.

I think that’s because they are kind of terrible demos. I watched all of them in a row this morning, he spends a few seconds on a given function then very quickly does several random hand adjustments and slathers effects all over everything. They might do well to enlist someone else to run through it, the machine still looks like it could be very deep.

But then, I too fall in the more interested in functions that aren’t granular crowd (also the never preorder anything and buy things rarely crowds).

P1505:

Off topic I know but given the brains on this forum surely we can design and manufacture our own dream machines?

Outside of norns/monome-specific stuff, there has occasionally been some brainstorming along those lines, but there is always the risk of a too many cooks scenario. Small breakout groups might be the way to go.

Shiftr · 2024-01-07T07:22:00.280Z

0x1F433:

you have (only) 2 play modes

What other playmodes are you thinking about?