#49

can some of this mentioned latency be due to the MPE protocol, the way each note’s messages are sent on a unique MIDI channel, rotating through all channels (or a defined contiguous block of channels)?

#50

Not really. The MIDI note message size is the same regardless of channel. The only difference is you can’t use running status, but that’s not used in the USB MIDI spec anyway.

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#51

Roli has released a “new app” called Seaboard 5D that is essentially the original NOISE app. I received an email detailing what it is and how they express their deepest appologies for removing RISE support for the new NOISE. We’ll see where this goes though. I’m just happy i can use my board at the coffee shop again without schlepping around my laptop despite knowing full well that Equator is a far superior engine. I find having less options is a better way to promote the spontaneous, especially when it comes to noodling on the go.

#53

lightpad block arrive in the mail today. My initial impression so far:

  • the combined latency of the block + bluetooth + noise app makes it near unusable
  • the block’s touch tracking itself accounts for roughly 20-25% of the latency
  • some of the “latency” seems like it is really due to how high the initial pressure threshold is for registering a touch
  • once a touch is registered the continuous tracking seems okay latency wise (but not great)

Using via usb and Max 7 was a bit more positive. The latency was low enough that I would see it used for modulation controls but still not something which was playable like a grid.

Hopefully the firmware on the block will improve and connecting it directly to something like ansible/earthsea (with the requisite firmware hacking) will yield something useful.

#54

…I should add that it appears as if it only sends SYSEX messages for everything, not a mixture of MPE and SYSEX for stuff which doesn’t fit within the spec.

Seems like a poor choice which largely prevents any meaningful interoperability.

…actually if Max isn’t running then it appears to switch to using normal MIDI messages (hopefully MPE). Weird design.

#55

I wrote my impressions from spending some time with them at the Apple Store the other day, in a different thread:

#56

If you’re wondering about the technical decisions and the protocol used, this talk by Jules may shed some light on things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lawj6GbkK2I&t=1416s

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#57

Many thanks for the tip.

I’ve started to poke at it via libusb and there is a fair amount of embedded smarts depending on which usb interface one acquires. The latency does seem to be much lower when it is operating as a straight midi controller (still far cry from a soundplane or continuum).

This video was also instructive: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3mmMIvvghQ

It mentions API mode vs normal mode (and all the SYSEX).

#58

Pretty interesting talk, thanks for the link!

#59

Yes, it was an interesting talk.

I found the comments on Forth and Lisp amusing.

I’m not sure it actually makes me want to own a Block though… possibly the opposite!

#60

I managed to pick up a nearly new Roli Block for the kind of price I was expecting to pay when I saw them. If there is any major fault with Roli Blocks, its that it is beyond the price at which you can accept its limitations.

it seems to me that with the Apple store deal, they had to hit a release date in November, which may have led to the mixed messages over launch. Likely Noise app needed a few more weeks before launch but they had to hit early November, to get it into stores/gift guides, and I can understand that. it remains to be seen if they can tighten up the latency in the app through updates.

I also wonder if we will see an updated hardware coming in 2017 once they improve the design. This does feel like it was released for the Christmas gift market, to appease their venture capital backers, as opposed to whether Roli themselves felt it was 100% ready for launch.

#61

i got a block a few days ago.
i was only interested in using it with Max and the blocks package. It’s great. On plain Max.
It just doesn’t work at all in M4L, which makes it quite useless to me.

#62

Hows the wired latency directly in Max?

#63

Didn’t notice any. But i’m no drummer.

#64

That’s promising to hear, as by all accounts its super noticeable, even not from a drummers perspective (when wireless/bluetooth).

#65

its so funny because just now i got an email from roli saying we received your package and its contents but could not find your order number… therefore we don’t know if you want us to issue you a return or do you want a repair? should i ask them to repair the latency???

4 Likes
#66

Just a quick message in case you missed the recent updates :

  • M4L now WORKS
  • A few improvements make it easier to program
  • The latency in Bluetooth seems quite acceptable to me, but the display can be laggy, at the moment.
#67

I was going to bump this thread with my experiences of the last few weeks.

I am very impressed with blocks, I also have no problem with the latency and if you take into account that the FAQ says not to use non wired headphones, its fine.

Noise is not great but the new soundpacks at least make it more flexible but it’s crying out for a mixing page where you can alter volume and i think it needs a way to go to sounds directly not scroll through them.

Also the quantised rhythm parts (groove kits) seem to be slaves to a clock so if you press on an offbeat, you have to wait for the next beat for the drum part to play, I suspect this is where most people get the unacceptable latency issues.

Having a small bluetooth MPE controller is lovely for using with apps on an IOS device, and I was really interested in using it with my MIDI sequencer (Kilpatrick Carbon) as an alternative to a keyboard, where you just need to input notes and the sequencer will take care of the rest.

Unfortunately my Carbon seems to freak out when you put a USB3 device into the USB host port, but I hope that the upcoming Blocks dashboard might allow you to limit the data that the device spits out. ( similar to configuring Rise to single channel mode)

I managed to get mine at a very reduced price, So I am not sure I would be so forgiving if I had paid RRP for it, YMMV

#68

Oh, a precision then :
i did not try any of the ROLI apps or software or whatever. Only Max and M4L with the Max Package.

1 Like
#69

hey gang - very late to the party, but curious if anyone else been pushing forwards with Blocks? I’ve been having some nice early success using it as a simple XYZ controller, but could see myself building some visual feedback for ‘modular-esque’ max patches. Has anyone played around with blocks.jit.matrix?

Also, v curious to see what else other folks have cooked up so far - I posted this one in the MPE/touch controller thread, so hopefully not spamming, but here’s a lil sketch with a block + aalto/kaivo: https://www.instagram.com/p/BTcNlxMF3qH/?taken-by=gan.tttt

would love to see what other left-of-center blocks projects are out there!

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