Serge thread

[kbit]

As @Jonny has said, the two grounds should theoretically be the same, however there are situations where that not be the case and you could end up with a ground loop.

Ground loop (electricity)

I would think that connecting signal ground of both devices would be the way to go but I might be wrong. You’re safe to connect to the earth ground screw but if you start noticing noise/humming within your signal path when using the two instruments together you might need to switch it up.

[Jonny]

I’d use that grounding screw if you have it readily available like that.

[lijnenspel]

Hi! I’m looking for a way to connect my full small R*S 4x4 serge skiff to my norns. I don’t have the R*S output module and I’m wondering what’s the most minimal and safe way to get some audio out from the serge into the norns? Looking for something external or even better something small enough so I can fit it inside the skiff (and drill some holes for jacks?)

edit: for context this is my skiff

[rycolos]

Cheapest/easiest would probably just be some banana to 1/4” passive attenuators. That’s what I’d do in a pinch. Unless you’re also looking for a solution that mixes and sums? Then probably a handful of passive attenuators and an outboard mixer.

[VicenteJr]

You can always get a format jumbler box. Always handy. It converts banana signals to jack/mini jack (and vice/versa) and takes care of grounding banana stuff with external gear. Small, passive devices. I drilled a couple of holes on mine and connected a couple 100k pots so i can send 2 extra audio signals from the Serge and attenuate/mix them before they hit other gear.

[gnome666]

Wondering if anyone based in the US has any leads on PSU’s for serge systems. Other than ordering RS PSUs from patchpoint or RS directly (who are sold out anyway), the only other prebuilt solution I’ve come across is Konstant Labs Cihula PSU (which also I cannot find for sale domestically). I know Elby designs has one, but I think its DIY kit. I dont have the IDY skills, and I know that DIY builders can build them. I’m just wondering why 1. Prebuilt PSU’s arent more readily available (as it seems theres a fair bit of demand) and 2. None of the synth distributors in the US seem to stock any R*S PSU’s?

[emenel]

Not in the US, but my favourite PSU is the Loudest Warning portable one. I have two for my 5 boats, they work great, look great, and are easy to gig (if you do that).

Ships from London, but everything I’ve ordered from Charlie has arrived quickly.

[Jonny]

@gnome666

I’m just wondering why 1. Prebuilt PSU’s arent more readily available (as it seems theres a fair bit of demand) and 2. None of the synth distributors in the US seem to stock any R*S PSU’s?

Some reasons:

• There is a lot of DIY. In fact, Random Source started by making panels for the CGS boards, from what I’ve seen, and eventually partnered with Serge to make new designs.
• Lack of an agreed upon standard connector choice. Although molex and neutrik jacks seems to be the most common.
• Early Serge uses a +6v line in addition to the +12,-12, and ground that newer designs use.

Yes, Random Source doesn’t seem to have much distribution for the Serge stuff in the states and it’s probably a demand thing. People are buying way more eurorack modules than 4U.

[gnome666]

I’ve got him working on a minipanel for me at the moment…maybe I’ll see if I can add a PSU to that…

[vals]

@emenel your PSU from Loudest Warning uses XLR connectors (to connect R*S boats)?
What’s the size/weight of it?
a single Konstant Labs CIHLA can handle 4 boats. Any comparisons on power/portability?
I’m on the plans of LaBestia & Edelweiss and with an option of 2 more boats on the far future…
Also some LW PSU picts would be welcomed…

[emenel]

Yes, it’s XLR connectors for RS style boats, although I have a SWAMP panel also connected to it … it works with any Serge you just need the right power cable.

One power supply runs 3 boats. I previously had the RS power supply, which has 5 connectors but is in reality nowhere near enough power for 5 boats, unless some of them are really light power draw.

The LW power supply is based on the Ebly one I believe, but Charlie makes his own ultra-portable enclosure for it that comes in many fun colours

I have one grey and one orange running my 5 boats. I play live a lot, and tour, so I need power that is very portable. The RS power supply is heavy and huge, and really not that powerful. The Konstant one is also heavy and huge but a little more powerful I think.

Here is a pic of one of mine so you can get a sense of the size, but Charlie has much better pics online.

Drago Nstout

Drago Nstout

[gnome666]

@emenel

LW power supply is based on the Ebly one I believe, but Charlie makes his own ultra-portable enclosure for it that comes in many fun colours

I inquired about his power supplies, and they are based on the Elby design. Here is another colorway for those interested (not my system but wish it was )

[jorgen83]

I love that panel. Especially the buckshot part with all the banana jacks. Are they all spaced for shorting bars?

[philmaguire]

Do any 73-75 builders have recommendations for rack ears? I’ve mounted mine in two Hammond 1444-1773 cases and looking for ears that will suit this, so I can mount in a 19" rack.

[lsky]

Not a 73-75 builder here, but a possible future Voice panel owner.

I’m pretty close to ordering the panel, however, reading through the old Serge handbook got me a bit worried. The handbook puts very strong emphasis on NEVER, NEVER EVER plugging an output into another output. There is also word about some protective circuits, but the point about never doing something like this is made very clear…

Now I know this is (apart from making no sense) not recommended with any gear. But since this is something that happens to me quite often with my Eurorack setup, I was wondering if anyone of the 73-75 owners around here maybe knows how the system will handle these kinds of mistakes. I’m a bit scared to blow up my unit right away, especially since I’m not even 100% familiar with what the different jacks actually are supposed to be used for…

[emenel]

Yeah, I haven’t had any catastrophes with my Random Source based 4U system either.

I’ll also add that Serge panel layouts generally put the inputs and outputs in separate places that are labeled and easy to differentiate, unlike a lot of eurorack modules.

[niall]

Now I know this is (apart from making no sense) not recommended with any gear.

This is easier to do inadvertently than you might think; if you stack two outputs into a single input, you’re effectively connecting an output to another output. In most cases, they’ll just say the results will be unpredictable and suboptimal, but there are some some rare cases where you’re putting your system at risk.

There’s an informative thread about this at MW. Especially CLee’s posts.

[lsky]

Thanks, for the all answers! Just out of curiosity: Is this the same for banana cables and eurorack patch cables? I was just wondering since banana cables don’t carry ground but the TS/TRS ones do, if I’m correct. However, my knowledge of electronics is (still) very limited, and I don’t know if these issues are even related…

[vals]

planning on banana cables, I was wondering on the average cable usage per panel (say in LaBestia/Animal but don’t stick on it). Particularly:

• how many cables?
• what lengths?

Some friends say around 30 per panel with a combination of 4", 8", 12" and 18".
Also, what cables to patch between pannels? 18" or 24" ?

any suggestions from your experience?

[DMR]

Eurorack using tip / sleeve with signal / ground vs. banana cables with a single conductor isn’t relevant here. Keep in mind that for both Eurorack and Banana systems, the modules share ground via the power supply header as well.