#26

ahhhh, a linked-list structure explains the CV and TT control paradigm for cues. also makes sense for thinking of the tape as a 90-minute tape loop, rather than an off-the-shelf cassette—one could think of the start of the tape as just where the two ends meet, useful only for orientation purposes. So without a rewrite, it looks like absolutely-indexed cue navigation will be unlikely.

I wonder if it would be interesting to disconnect the order of cue points from their position on the tape? Probably would require users to have a pretty complicated mental model of the module’s state though…

It also seems like splitting the record and play heads further apart will be unlikely given RAM limitations (also since the only use cases I can think of are delays, of which the ‘regular’ kind are well covered by setting loop points).

I agree that Teletype control of tape speed sounds interesting, although it does seem better suited to knob or CV control to me than scripting.

This week I wanna try disconnecting play state from mode and see where that gets me… just need those headers to get here!

1 Like
#27

I’ve been testing w/ type firmware a bit.
I think setting tape speed with teletype would give more precise control over playback/recording.

2 Likes
#28

TT controlled tape speed is definitely forthcoming, but it requires answering some difficult questions about design. I wish I’d had more time to think of this by now…

@alanza
The LL structure isn’t that constricting. Max number of cues is ~1300 per tape, so even worst-case scenario it’s only 650 steps, which actually doesn’t take that long! The firmware already attempts to find cue-points in an absolute fashion if it discovers it’s out of place. Also the NAV.THIS redirection uses this same absolute referencing already.

Ultimately I’d like there to be relative & absolute accessing modes available and we’ve been discussing some syntax for it.

The goal is to have as few operators as possible such that they are combinable to implement vastly different control structures without needing to remember too many things. Like most of our creations, technical limitations are typically not the barriers, but rather it’s in finding the right abstraction.

6 Likes
#29

Not sure if this has been mentioned or implemented yet, but being able to clear a tape of audio and cues without power-cycling the synth is my number one feature request/need :slight_smile:

EDIT: I guess that’s not really a TYPE feat request, but :man_shrugging:

4 Likes
#30

@analogue01 I asked this here:


and @galapagoose responded:

1 Like
#31

Interesting. Thanks. Technical and logistical issues aside, I would argue that it’s definitely a performative command (or at least something needed to enhance the speed and smoothness of certain performative gestures). I routinely use the 10-20 sec tape loop sound on sound mode on my el cap, which lets you clear all the sound in it’s buffer by triple tapping one of the switches and have found that feature very useful on stage. Use cases include: easing the transition between sections, rapidly shifting/dropping density of sound for a sudden transition, quickly escaping a badly timed or poor loop. Also, clearing dumb sounds from soundcheck without power-cycling the synth makes sound-check potentially much easier (of course if clearing a tape makes a giant pop that’s probably no good either, tho powering down kind of does that, too). Finally, it makes recording much faster because you can quickly try different ideas and clear loops that don’t work without fiddling with feedback or cue point or whatever.

#32

have you tried doing these things with CV into that in live mode? I agree about these effects being useful for performance, and I’ve found that to be a really effective and musically interesting way to clear space

(another possibility could be engaging overwrite record either through buttons or Teletype?)

#33

Yeah, currently I just turn down the feedback (that) if I want to overwrite a loop live. But if your loop is, say, 3min long it still limits the type of transitions you can make. Not that that’s always a bad thing. Just different from how I like to work sometimes. It’s much closer to working with real tape.

2 Likes
#34

yeah that’s fair. although, with overwrite engaged, shouldn’t you never hear your old sounds again regardless of loop length? guess I should play with this some more.

#35

It’s probably so obvious that it doesn’t need to be mentioned, but direct control over THIS and THAT is a must. It would be cool to be able to initialize a script that pops you straight into a “tape delay” type of effect, then use PARAM, Txi or a script to dynamically control variables.

1 Like
#36

the latest 2.3 beta (or rather a release candidate) now includes w/ ops: Teletype 3.0

5 Likes
#37

I agree. I do like how the existing “play” command decouples the “play” state from the module’s mode, though, and it would be interesting if we could find a way to do something similar with some of the this and that functions.

#38

Seconding this. Also, just output volume control would be good for mixing scenarios, and also shaping via Teletype “envelope” or LFO.

Another idea: a TW mode which pairs or groups multiple W/s together so they can be addressed simultaneously. Good for stereo scenarios, or recording multiple voices at once to create ‘stems’ that can then be manipulated independently.

Even cooler would be if the grouping mode also applied to physical controls, so that once say 2 W/s are paired they can be controlled from the switch and buttons together. This would make for a playable stereo pair. I don’t know if this is possible with sample accuracy over i2c (or at W/s subdivision rate) but it would be neat.

1 Like
#39

There is some control over output volume in live mode via negative offset into that! (and possibly recording nothing)

I’m actually pulling hard for the opposite use case—being able to address multiple W/'s separately over I2C, but I also would appreciate synchronicity.

I keep feeling like a great level-up idea for W/ Type is on the tip of my tongue lately…

1 Like
#40

This is good! I would love for it to be decoupled from mode though and also directly addressable.

Oh I would definitely want that and I guess, since I don’t yet have multiple W/, asks a question: is that what happens now if you have multiple W/ on your network? I.e. ws.play -1 sets all your networked W/s running backwards?

#41

that would be my guess, since every module on the I2C bus sees every message, each W/ ought to think the messages are meant for it

#42

correct; they’re all set to the same mode/direction.

my w/ firmware wishlist for teletype control:

  1. address multiple individual w/ units
    • e.g. WS.1, WS.2. or W1, W2 to keep down character count.
  2. insert cue points
    • e.g. WS.CUE.ADD
    • example: begin recording audio in, adding cue points along the way. as rec finishes and the loop begins, triggers from meadowphysics add more cue points, while the playhead moves between these new points via motion/jumps generated by other mp triggers, or teletype randomness. the audio cascade grows ever denser. would likely need something like a delete cue point operator (WS.CUE.DEL) to reign in the chaos.
  3. absolute cue point navigation
    • e.g. WS.CNAV x
    • example: jump to cue point 12 (of e.g. 20, no matter the previous cue location). instant nonlinear navigation much like mlr/mlrv sample-cutting! though this is a bit outside the linear nature of tape that w/ emulates. would probably be tricky to implement, as the number of cue points might be unknown & variable.
  4. clear current tape
  5. switch tapes
    • example: see #4 above. useful in a live performance context between songs, or even within a song. after doing a lot of destructive overwriting or looping, switch to a clean tape, work up a different set of sound manipulations, then return to the earlier version on the first tape.
  6. set exact tape speed
    • example: the current choice of forward, reverse, or stopped is decently norns-mlr-like, but being able to easily set any desired speed in either play direction would open up so many new sounds.
  7. “user mode”
    • example: create a desired configuration of w/, such as a gritty delay. load this delay via teletype, so that any audio fed in is immediately output as a thick, decaying echo. THIS and THAT inputs either work as expected from other modes, or are user-assignable, e.g. controlling decay length, grit/worn tape, etc.
    • separately control THIS/THAT via teletype, independent of w/ mode.

if THIS/THAT and the joystick actions had w/-type equivalents, i think most or all of this wishlist would be fulfilled. thanks for your consideration!

7 Likes
#43

Yes! I’m particularly keen on point 6 but I could immediately benefit from 2 and your second point in 7 - I imagine that control of the tape speed would be a TT command for THAT

#44

#2,3 & 4 would be great. The ability to add more precise cues would help keep things in sync.

#45

1, 2, 3 and 4 sound really great!

Outside of THIS and THAT being user-assignable, 7 just sounds like loading a TT scene. :slight_smile: